What would you do for a Klondike Bar?

Jason Gregor
June 11 2009 09:54PM

Remember that jingle? This commercial illustrates just how easy it could be… If life was only this easy, imagine what your lady friend would do if you cleared the whole table??? Dare to dream boys, dare to dream. Of course remember once you set that precedent then you’ll be expected to do it again. So weigh your options. What would you do for Heatley Bar? That is the question many teams will ponder for the next three weeks, since I expect the Sens to trade the former Calgary Canuck before his $4 million signing bonus is due on July 1st. Oiler fans what would you give up for Heatley? While you ponder that, can you name the last Oiler to score 40 goals? (Answer at end of article). I bet many of you can’t recall the last Oiler to pot 40, and it’s doubtful you’ll remember the year. Hell, some of you were still in diapers. Yesterday I had Rob Daum, Perry Pearn and Clare Drake in studio. Daum had a great point about goal scoring. “It can change the outcome of a game more than any other element. It boosts your team, deflates the other, and can alter the entire game in a moment.” The Oilers haven’t had anyone who can do that with regularity in a long time, and it is clear that their owner recognizes that. I’ve been told that Daryl Katz is prepared to do whatever it takes to try and land Heatley. He has given Steve Tambellini the green light to put together a package that will ensure Bryan Murray doesn’t overlook them. That doesn’t mean he will grossly overpay for Heatley, rather, it seems that he would be willing to hide a salary in the minors come October if that’s what it takes. Let’s just clarify that it won’t be Horcoff or Penner, because that is too big a price to pay in the minors, plus putting either player there makes no sense. Basically the blessing is there for Tambellini not to worry about where everyone will fit when acquiring Heatley. It makes the GM’s job much easier if the owner gives him that sort of leeway. The Oilers are also very interested in trying to land Jay Bouwmeester. Could they land both? Highly unlikely because the odds of trading for a top-three goal scorer and signing a top-ten D-man in the span of ten days are near impossible, but Katz is willing to pull out all the stops to ensure they get one. Bouwmeester won’t cost any assets, but I’d still take Heatley over him right now. The Oilers have depth on the backend, but their scoring pool is thinner than Nicole Ritchie. You can argue that Heatley is a one-trick pony, but he is damn good at his one trick. He scores goals and he does it well. The Oilers sign him and you can mark him down for 40 goals. They don’t have anyone who is a sure bet to even score 30 right now. In the past four years he has scored 180 goals, 362 points and was a +82. Horcoff and Hemsky have combined for 151 goals in the same span. He has more career PP goals (99) than every Oiler has career goals, excluding Horcoff (120) and Moreau (136). Some argue he just finished an off year with 39 goals, but that still put him tied for 9th in the league and only one back of being tied for 5th. An off year for Heatley is a career year for 95% of the other players in the league. I don’t think it is trade for Heatley at any cost, because if you deal Hemsky that doesn’t leave Heatley much to play with, but every other player should be on the table. Regardless of who it will cost, the fact Katz has given his GM his blessing to make it happen, means the Oilers are not just in the mix, they might end up stirring the drink. ANSWER: Petr Klima was the last Oiler to score 40 when he potted 40 in 1990/1991. Here are the years the Oilers had a 30-goal man since Garbage Pail (Klima) potted 40: Smyth... 36... 2006 Comrie... 33... 2002 Smyth... 31... 2001 Guerin... 30... 1999 Smyth... 39 and Kovalenko 32... 1997 Ciger... 31... 1996 Arnott... 33... 1994 Klima... 32... 1993 Damphousse 38, and Murphy 35... 1992. Oilers had eight 20-goal scorers that year; Simpson 24, Mellanby 23, Klima 21, Nicholls 20, Buchberger 20 and Semenov 20.

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One of Canada's most versatile sports personalities. Jason hosts The Jason Gregor Show, weekdays from 2 to 6 p.m., on TSN 1260, and he writes a column every Monday in the Edmonton Journal. You can follow him on Twitter at twitter.com/JasonGregor
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#101 Jason Gregor
June 12 2009, 11:44AM
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speeds wrote:

Only one player, since the lockout, has scored more goals per game than Gaborik, that being Ovechkin.

In that stretch Gaborik played 207 games and had 123 goals. Heatley played 317 and had 180 goals.

Gaborik is 0.59 and Heatley 0.57...not a big difference, but who gave his team more. Who gave his team a better chance to win? Heatley. Plus because Gaborik had 13 goals in the first 17 games of the season, doesn't mean he would maintain that for the entire year. In full seasons he hasn't come close to Heatley.

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#102 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 11:45AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

@ Ogden Brother: What arent you getting about the problems of signing players above their actual value and the problems that causes when done consistently?

Because as far as we know it hasn't hurt us yet, and the team has the ability to correct mistakes.

All your complaining is about things that might happen sometime in the future, maybe.

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#103 Jason Gregor
June 12 2009, 11:47AM
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Al wrote:

Gregor, What is this chugging contest you are having today on your show? Where and when? My buddy is good at that.

Al, we are doing my show today, and most Fridays at the Walk About Pub on Whyte Ave. Today we are having a chuggin contest around 4 p.m. Winner gets Oiler jersey, Esks tickets, dinner GC, drink G.C and hats...Quickest wins.

Then we're watching game seven.

I'm curious if either BM or JS can chug. If you feel you can down the liquids quickly come to the Walk About Pub, 104 street and Whyte today.

And Steve Tambellini will be on at 3:10 if you want to listen in...will try to get some dirt from him...

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#104 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 11:47AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

@ Ogden Brother: Based on what? Tambellini’s track record as a GM in the league? blockquote> Based on the fact that FA's rarely outperform their contract and that Edmontons history is that top end players wont come here.
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#105 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 11:48AM
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@ Jason Gregor:

Gregor, hearing anything about Pronger to LA for JJ and the 5th?

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#106 Archaeologuy
June 12 2009, 11:50AM
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@ Ogden Brother: Youre right, mismanaging the Cap has never hurt anybody. It certainly didnt hurt the Flames at the end of the year. It wasnt a problem for the Flyers all year long. It wasnt a problem for the Ducks who lost a lot of young and good talent. The Cap is just a soft limit, right? No reason to be concerned when a team comes to within O'Sullivan's contract of the Cap but cant get a sniff of the playoffs. What's the big deal, eh?

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#107 Archaeologuy
June 12 2009, 11:53AM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Based on the fact that FA’s rarely outperform their contract and that Edmontons history is that top end players wont come here.

Well the big rumours of the moment dont include FAs coming to Edmonton do they? It turns out there's this thing teams can do with each other where they exchange assets like players and draft picks. It also turns out that the Oilers have a history of making several of these a season in attempts to gain players they covet.

I guess that punches a hole in any argument that assumes the only way to get players is via free agency.

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#108 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 11:56AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

@ Ogden Brother: Youre right, mismanaging the Cap has never hurt anybody. It certainly didnt hurt the Flames at the end of the year. It wasnt a problem for the Flyers all year long. It wasnt a problem for the Ducks who lost a lot of young and good talent. The Cap is just a soft limit, right? No reason to be concerned when a team comes to within O’Sullivan’s contract of the Cap but cant get a sniff of the playoffs. What’s the big deal, eh?

So what was the better way to do it? Should Calgary have not traded for Jokenin? Should Flyers have not signed Timmonen/Hartnell? What young and good talent have the Ducks lost?

Once again, your assuming they could get better players for cheaper, it's just not reality.

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#109 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 11:58AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Based on the fact that FA’s rarely outperform their contract and that Edmontons history is that top end players wont come here. Well the big rumours of the moment dont include FAs coming to Edmonton do they? It turns out there’s this thing teams can do with each other where they exchange assets like players and draft picks. It also turns out that the Oilers have a history of making several of these a season in attempts to gain players they covet. I guess that punches a hole in any argument that assumes the only way to get players is via free agency.

That was refering to you asking why I didn't think we'd be able to aquire players that "out play their contracts"

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#110 speeds
June 12 2009, 12:01PM
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Jason Gregor wrote:

Why? How much better will Gilbert get? Is he going to get tougher? Same with O’Sullivan? They are maybe’s to improve. Heatley is a guarantee to score at least 35 and probably 40 for the next few years I don't know how much better Gilbert and O'Sullivan will get, if any, nor do I know how much worse, if any, Heatley will get over the next 5 years. I do think it's likely that Gilbert and O'Sullivan get better, and Heatley gets worse, thus narrowing whatever difference in quality currently exists. What are you talking about? Has Gaborik had a 100 point season? Has he scored 50 goals? How is he better than Heatley in those areas? You honestly think Heatley was scoring 50 goals and 100 pts if he was in Gaborik's position in MIN? The raw totals are nice, but a little context doesn't hurt. Is he any better defensively than Heatley? Not by much, if any. And in the years he played close to full seasons he didn’t come close to Heatley’s totals, so you can’t use injuries as an excuse for those years. GP G A PTS 71 18 18 36 78 30 37 67 81 30 35 65 77 42 41 83 Those don’t come close to Heatley’s years. Sorry but Gaborik does not do everything better than Heatley other than staying healthy.

The first 3 years are Gaborik's 1st 3 NHL seasons. During Gaborik's first year Heatley was still in college. In Gaborik's second year he scored 30 goals at 19, while Heatley scored 26 for ATL (Heatley was 19 when draft, Gaborik 18 due to NCAA rules at that time). The next year, no question Heatley scored more goals than Gaborik, 41-30.

Gaborik's 83 pts for MIN, last year (he played nearly a full season last year, 77 games) was an absolute monster season playing in MIN. He led his team in scoring by 20 points. Heatley has led the Sens in scoring before as well, but never had to be the only offensive threat like Gaborik has had to.

I stand by saying Gaborik is a better player when healthy. I think it's reasonable to prefer Heatley to Gaborik given the health concerns, but personally I would rather try to acquire Gaborik for nothing but money and keep my valuable youngish players like O'Sullivan and Cogliano and 10th OV. Gilbert is a bit older, in fact he's only 2 years younger than Heatley, but because he's a defenceman and because he entered the NHL so late I don't think it unimaginable he'll continue to develop late, though by no means is it a given he'll progress from where he is now.

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#111 Antony Ta
June 12 2009, 12:04PM
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@ Archaeologuy:

Free agency is overrated if you can't retain the players you already have. Case in point: Smyth, Pronger, Pitkanen, Cole, Greene. All of them had varying degrees of contentment when it came to playing for the Oilers and all of them left under different circumstances, whether or not they wanted to leave or not. Signing free agents is secondary to keeping what you already have. If you don't have anything to show for it, it's time to dump the useless and acquire the useful. In this case, you can't get something without giving up something. And by that, I mean salary and talent for talent.

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#112 Archaeologuy
June 12 2009, 12:04PM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Should Calgary have not traded for Jokenin?

Absolutely not, it added a 3rd shooter on a line that already had 2. The production on that line was killed because it turns out only 1 player can shoot the puck at a time. It also precludes them having the opportunity to resign their best goal scorer, Cammalleri.

Ogden Brother wrote:

Should Flyers have not signed Timmonen/Hartnell?

No, they probably shouldnt have signed Briere a few years ago, its their problem now, but they will need to dump salary for almost nothing.

Ogden Brother wrote:

What young and good talent have the Ducks lost?

Penner, McDonald, and they were forced to bury Ryan in the minors longer than he needed to be. All because of the Cap.

Ogden Brother wrote:

Once again, your assuming they could get better players for cheaper, it’s just not reality.

Well the reality for them now is that they need to get rid of some quality players for almost nothing just to keep the status quo.

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#113 Archaeologuy
June 12 2009, 12:07PM
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@ Antony Ta: I never even brought up UFAs. Keeping players IS important. Keeping them at the right price is MORE important. What good has it done the Oilers to make sure that Horc (or anybody, lets not start another side argument about Horc) isnt leaving if his contract is poisonous to the team?

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#114 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 12:08PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Should Calgary have not traded for Jokenin? Absolutely not, it added a 3rd shooter on a line that already had 2. The production on that line was killed because it turns out only 1 player can shoot the puck at a time. It also precludes them having the opportunity to resign their best goal scorer, Cammalleri. Ogden Brother wrote: Should Flyers have not signed Timmonen/Hartnell? No, they probably shouldnt have signed Briere a few years ago, its their problem now, but they will need to dump salary for almost nothing. Ogden Brother wrote: What young and good talent have the Ducks lost? Penner, McDonald, and they were forced to bury Ryan in the minors longer than he needed to be. All because of the Cap. Ogden Brother wrote: Once again, your assuming they could get better players for cheaper, it’s just not reality. Well the reality for them now is that they need to get rid of some quality players for almost nothing just to keep the status quo.

Whe the Oil lose Hemsky/Gagner/Cogs or someone of the ilk because of a lack of cap space your position will be justified, until then it's just the same old baseless nonsense everyday.

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#115 speeds
June 12 2009, 12:09PM
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Sorry Jason, I screwed up the tags in the first half of my reply, here it is more friendly to look at.

Gregor wrote: Why? How much better will Gilbert get? Is he going to get tougher? Same with O’Sullivan? They are maybe’s to improve. Heatley is a guarantee to score at least 35 and probably 40 for the next few years I don’t know how much better Gilbert and O’Sullivan will get, if any, nor do I know how much worse, if any, Heatley will get over the next 5 years. I do think it’s likely that Gilbert and O’Sullivan get better, and Heatley gets worse, thus narrowing whatever difference in quality currently exists. What are you talking about? Has Gaborik had a 100 point season? Has he scored 50 goals? How is he better than Heatley in those areas? You honestly think Heatley was scoring 50 goals and 100 pts if he was in Gaborik’s position in MIN? The raw totals are nice, but a little context doesn’t hurt.

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#116 speeds
June 12 2009, 12:10PM
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sorry once again.

Gregor wrote:

Why? How much better will Gilbert get? Is he going to get tougher? Same with O’Sullivan? They are maybe’s to improve. Heatley is a guarantee to score at least 35 and probably 40 for the next few years

speeds reply:

I don’t know how much better Gilbert and O’Sullivan will get, if any, nor do I know how much worse, if any, Heatley will get over the next 5 years.

I do think it’s likely that Gilbert and O’Sullivan get better, and Heatley gets worse, thus narrowing whatever difference in quality currently exists.

What are you talking about? Has Gaborik had a 100 point season? Has he scored 50 goals? How is he better than Heatley in those areas?

You honestly think Heatley was scoring 50 goals and 100 pts if he was in Gaborik’s position in MIN? The raw totals are nice, but a little context doesn’t hurt.

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#117 Jason Gregor
June 12 2009, 12:12PM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

@ Jason Gregor: Gregor, hearing anything about Pronger to LA for JJ and the 5th?

I just sent a text to Strickland I'll let you know.

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#118 Archaeologuy
June 12 2009, 12:14PM
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@ Ogden Brother: So its ok to act like those clubs I mentioned until its a problem? You dont see it as a place for concern at all? My position HAS been justified by the problems those teams face today because of the way they treated the Cap.

What I dont get is how you can ignore all of those problems and say it hasnt happened here yet so its no big deal.

Thats like moving your trailer into Tornado alley and saying nothing will happen because it hasnt happened yet.

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#119 Jason Gregor
June 12 2009, 12:14PM
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speeds wrote:

You honestly think Heatley was scoring 50 goals and 100 pts if he was in Gaborik’s position in MIN? The raw totals are nice, but a little context doesn’t hurt.

You can never say if a guy scores more goals in one team than another. Would Doug Weight have scored 100 points if he played somewhere other than Edmonton. Who knows. Look at Rolston's numbers in Minnesota and when he left. He produced more in Minny?

Fact is Heatley scores and stays healthy. Gaborik doesn't. I don't want a guy for 6 or 7 million playing half the time. Not worth it.

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#120 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 12:18PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

@ Ogden Brother: So its ok to act like those clubs I mentioned until its a problem? You dont see it as a place for concern at all? My position HAS been justified by the problems those teams face today because of the way they treated the Cap. What I dont get is how you can ignore all of those problems and say it hasnt happened here yet so its no big deal. Thats like moving your trailer into Tornado alley and saying nothing will happen because it hasnt happened yet.

Again, because you are assuming those teams would be better off without the player and with the open cap space... meaning it could be used more effeciently. Which is at best, a stretch.

You sign the best players you can, you ice the best team you can. You don't let players go and keep cap space free hoping that sometime in the future you'll have someone better to fill it with.

This team is better with Horc+Penner then it is with 9 million in cap space and 2 holes on the first line.

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#121 Jason Gregor
June 12 2009, 12:21PM
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Strickland's post is much more vague now, it looks like he changed it, so I'm guessing nothing is happening right now, but I'm gonna make a call to LA just to be sure.

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#122 speeds
June 12 2009, 12:27PM
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Jason Gregor wrote:

speeds wrote: You can never say if a guy scores more goals in one team than another. Would Doug Weight have scored 100 points if he played somewhere other than Edmonton. Who knows. Look at Rolston’s numbers in Minnesota and when he left. He produced more in Minny? Fact is Heatley scores and stays healthy. Gaborik doesn’t. I don’t want a guy for 6 or 7 million playing half the time. Not worth it.

If you want to argue that Heatley's a better fit because he stays healthier, as I said already, I think that's a fair argument.

And it's true that sometimes players produce numbers that are different from the expectations you had. With Rolston it is a bit strange that his two best seasons were in MIN, my guess would be that he saw more PP time there than he had previously but that's only a guess from looking at his career PP goals by season:

http://www.hockey-reference.com/players/r/rolstbr01.html

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#123 swany
June 12 2009, 12:29PM
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Jason Gregor wrote:

Strickland’s post is much more vague now, it looks like he changed it, so I’m guessing nothing is happening right now, but I’m gonna make a call to LA just to be sure.

Gregor if said trade is TRUE does this not open up a team for the Oilers to send Souray, if LA deals CFP and Nieds isn't comming back would the Ducks look at Souray? That would be ideal and we could just ask for picks/prospect this would pave the way to sign Jay-Bo and then send Gilbert, Cogs and another small roster player to the Sens for heatly. If Jay-bo would take a front loaded contract (alla Detriot) and a cap hit of 6 mil we only add 2.5 mil to our cap.

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#124 Archaeologuy
June 12 2009, 12:30PM
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@ Ogden Brother: Because those teams gambled short term they now need to get rid of a few of the players that actually made them a good team. You cant have every team be at the Cap Max and expect any of them to get better.

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#125 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 12:35PM
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Jason Gregor wrote:

Strickland’s post is much more vague now, it looks like he changed it, so I’m guessing nothing is happening right now, but I’m gonna make a call to LA just to be sure.

Archaeologuy wrote:

@ Ogden Brother: Because those teams gambled short term they now need to get rid of a few of the players that actually made them a good team. You cant have every team be at the Cap Max and expect any of them to get better.

Well they haven't got rid of any good players yet (Flyers/Flames) and if they do, it was because we walked into the 2nd (as of now) worst recession in modern history.

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#126 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 12:36PM
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Jason Gregor wrote:

Strickland’s post is much more vague now, it looks like he changed it, so I’m guessing nothing is happening right now, but I’m gonna make a call to LA just to be sure.

Striklands usually bang on, king of makes me wonder if the deal is done, but wasn't supposed to be announced yet.

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#127 speeds
June 12 2009, 12:39PM
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that could make sense, with game 7 tonight, if the NHL has asked teams not to announce any trades until the Cup finals are over for a day or two.

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#128 Archaeologuy
June 12 2009, 12:41PM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Well they haven’t got rid of any good players yet (Flyers/Flames) and if they do, it was because we walked into the 2nd (as of now) worst recession in modern history.

Flames are losing Cammalleri, The Flyers are in the worst position of any team in the league. You cant blame the economy. The Cap isnt arbitrary, it's tied to revenues. That's exactly why you need to leave yourself some flexibility. They didnt and they got burned for it.

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#129 Jason Gregor
June 12 2009, 12:41PM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Striklands usually bang on, king of makes me wonder if the deal is done, but wasn’t supposed to be announced yet.

He is tight with the Human Rake so must be on to something I would think.swany wrote:

Gregor if said trade is TRUE does this not open up a team for the Oilers to send Souray, if LA deals CFP and Nieds isn’t comming back would the Ducks look at Souray? That would be ideal and we could just ask for picks/prospect this would pave the way to sign Jay-Bo and then send Gilbert, Cogs and another small roster player to the Sens for heatly. If Jay-bo would take a front loaded contract (alla Detriot) and a cap hit of 6 mil we only add 2.5 mil to our cap.

Your idea has merit, if indeed Niedermayer retires. If not, then they might not have much cap space either.

But until that deal happens, if it happens, we won't know for sure. I do know that the Oilers will court Jay-Bo.

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#130 Archaeologuy
June 12 2009, 12:45PM
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@ Jason Gregor: The Score is reporting the Trade now!

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#131 swany
June 12 2009, 12:56PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

@ Jason Gregor: The Score is reporting the Trade now!

Ludz has confermed the trade done friggen deal get on the horn and move Souray to the Ducks and sign Jay-Bo July 1st but until then when's the presser to announce Heatly for Gilbert,Cogs, Osully (hahahaha) if Tambo pulls that off GM of the year baby.

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#132 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 12:57PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Well they haven’t got rid of any good players yet (Flyers/Flames) and if they do, it was because we walked into the 2nd (as of now) worst recession in modern history. Flames are losing Cammalleri, The Flyers are in the worst position of any team in the league. You cant blame the economy. The Cap isnt arbitrary, it’s tied to revenues. That’s exactly why you need to leave yourself some flexibility. They didnt and they got burned for it.

Supposedly Cammy was gone anyways.

The worst position in the leauge? Good grief man, they have an excellent young core and and an owner thats willing to spend above the cap. I'd swap our roster with theirs any day.

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#133 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 12:59PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Well they haven’t got rid of any good players yet (Flyers/Flames) and if they do, it was because we walked into the 2nd (as of now) worst recession in modern history. Flames are losing Cammalleri, The Flyers are in the worst position of any team in the league. You cant blame the economy. The Cap isnt arbitrary, it’s tied to revenues. That’s exactly why you need to leave yourself some flexibility. They didnt and they got burned for it.

And of course you can blame the economy, the cap rose 10%+ every year since it's inception, now it will do (rumoured) -15 to -20%. Even a modest 5% increas in revenue/year would have left all of the "have" teams in a good position.

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#134 Archaeologuy
June 12 2009, 01:02PM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

The worst position in the leauge? Good grief man, they have an excellent young core and and an owner thats willing to spend above the cap. I’d swap our roster with theirs any day.

And we'd have that roster until September when we start forfeiting games for being over the cap.

Or we have that team and then start to dismantle it so we ARENT over the cap and dont have to forfeit games. Then it really wouldnt be the same team now would it?

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#135 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 01:16PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: The worst position in the leauge? Good grief man, they have an excellent young core and and an owner thats willing to spend above the cap. I’d swap our roster with theirs any day. And we’d have that roster until September when we start forfeiting games for being over the cap. Or we have that team and then start to dismantle it so we ARENT over the cap and dont have to forfeit games. Then it really wouldnt be the same team now would it?

What on earth are you talking about? The odds of Philly losing anyone of quality for 09/10 are slim to nill.

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#136 Archaeologuy
June 12 2009, 01:26PM
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@ Ogden Brother: Depends what happens to the Cap, darned Cap.

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#137 Antony Ta
June 12 2009, 01:39PM
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@ Archaeologuy:

That's exactly what I'm trying to say too, but I probably didn't communicate it very well. The Oilers have not, in recent years, set a precedent for signing good contracts. They shunned Ryan Smyth when he was willing to take a 1+ M hometown discount, but they dished out the money to Roloson, Moreau, Pisani, and Penner, for lesser reasons, imo. Doesn't matter if it's an RFA or a UFA, if it's a big name player you're going to need major incentive for the player to sign in the city for less than "market" value. Either that is (a) implicit promise of a championship (a la Hossa/Detroit) or (b) team loyalty (a la Pavel Datsyuk). Edmonton is in no position to promise a championship and team loyalty would require a long precedent for signing good contracts (which we already mentioned, doesn't exist here yet). The oft-cited examples are Shawn Horcoff and Sheldon Souray. The one exception is perhaps Ales Hemsky who is signed to a wonderful contract. But with recent developments, I can see Hemsky demanding a hefty raise in the future. A very hefty raise.

If they want to fix the precedent for signing bad contracts, it has to start by removing the ones that already exist. Does this have anything to do with Dany Heatley? I don't think so, since his contract was signed with Ottawa. We would have to make cap space for him but it's the player we want, not the salary. Mind you, Hossa almost signed here for 8+ million last summer.

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#138 Ogden Brother
June 12 2009, 02:11PM
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Antony Ta wrote:

@ Archaeologuy: That’s exactly what I’m trying to say too, but I probably didn’t communicate it very well. The Oilers have not, in recent years, set a precedent for signing good contracts. They shunned Ryan Smyth when he was willing to take a 1+ M hometown discount, but they dished out the money to Roloson, Moreau, Pisani, and Penner, for lesser reasons, imo. Doesn’t matter if it’s an RFA or a UFA, if it’s a big name player you’re going to need major incentive for the player to sign in the city for less than “market” value. Either that is (a) implicit promise of a championship (a la Hossa/Detroit) or (b) team loyalty (a la Pavel Datsyuk). Edmonton is in no position to promise a championship and team loyalty would require a long precedent for signing good contracts (which we already mentioned, doesn’t exist here yet). The oft-cited examples are Shawn Horcoff and Sheldon Souray. The one exception is perhaps Ales Hemsky who is signed to a wonderful contract. But with recent developments, I can see Hemsky demanding a hefty raise in the future. A very hefty raise. If they want to fix the precedent for signing bad contracts, it has to start by removing the ones that already exist. Does this have anything to do with Dany Heatley? I don’t think so, since his contract was signed with Ottawa. We would have to make cap space for him but it’s the player we want, not the salary. Mind you, Hossa almost signed here for 8+ million last summer.

You know at the time, Hemsky's contract was considerd high. He'll also be demanding a raise because PPG players make 6+ million/year...not because of recent developments.

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#139 misfit
June 12 2009, 02:39PM
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what's with the Heatley vs. Gaborik debate all about?

Heatley is an option. He's asked for a trade (which I'm sure he'll get), and he's already stated that he'd waive his NTC to play in Edmonton.

Gaborik could be an option on July 1, but he'd have to chose Edmonton over 29 other teams calling and making offers for his services. You can debate the positives and negatives of Edmonton all you want, but we haven't exactly proven to be a top UFA destination around the league.

It's not like it's just a matter of chosing which one you want. Our options aren't "Heatley or Gaborik", they're "Heatley or whatever we've already got on the roster". Aquiring Heatley is a somewhat realistic option. Signing Gaborik on July 1st isn't, and we should all know that by now. Ditto for Bouwmeester.

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#140 misfit
June 12 2009, 02:41PM
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"what's with the Heatley vs. Gaborik debate all about?"

That's some mighty fine english right there.

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#141 swany
June 12 2009, 02:59PM
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Sportsnet has confermed the trade Pronger for JJ and the 5th I like what the LA gm did he got rid of a headcase for a stud d-man and now he doesn't have to move any young forwards for Heatly as he can just sign Gabby

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#142 Jason Gregor
June 12 2009, 03:39PM
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Eric Duhatchek reported it isn't true. I spoke with Rishaug and Bob McKenzie told him that at this point there is no deal.

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#143 Deans
June 12 2009, 04:11PM
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Deans wrote:

The oilers arent gettin Heatley. Teams just use the oilers to up the barganing or contract price.

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