GDB minus-2: It's crunch time

Jason Gregor
September 24 2009 02:20PM

capn-quinn

Tonight is the last chance for players to impress the coaches, and when you look at tonight’s roster it is pretty clear which players are on the bubble.

Nilsson — Brule — Stone MacIntyre — Reddox — Stortini Moreau — Gagner — Cogliano Penner — Schremp — Eberle

Grebeshkov — Staios Chorney — Gilbert Smid — Visnovsky

Deslauriers and Dubnyk

Stone, Brule, Nilsson, Reddox, MacIntyre, Schremp and Eberle are all on the bubble. And so is Pouliot, but he is out with a slight muscle pull.

Quinn hinted today that if Pouliot and Pisani don’t get into Sunday’s game, they might get veteran status and be on the 23 man roster. Pisani is shooting to play on Sunday so we’ll wait and see.

It sounds like Quinn is leaning towards moving Cogliano to the wing and will keep Gagner and either Comrie or O'Sullivan and Horcoff as the other top three centres.

It is also interesting to look at the D-pairings for tonight. I don’t think it is a guarantee that the top four will consist of 44, 71, 77 and 37. Renney wants his defense to be more aggressive, especially at the blueline. But they can only stand up the opposing forwards if the Oiler forwards are backchecking.

The story so far...

Through six pre-season games the forwards and D-men haven’t been that cohesive yet. Quinn said it was almost like they were playing as two separate units, and there was too much space between them, especially in the neutral zone.

I’m curious how long it will take for those who ripped MacTavish for sucking the offence out of young Oilers to say the same about Quinn.

Quinn is adamant that this team will be better defensively before they work on their offence. Doesn’t that sound a lot like MacTavish? The difference is that this coaching staff has a different approach in how they are selling that message.

According to the players, the coaches have consistently relayed the same messages every day. Last year, after many games MacTavish and the media and the fans complained the team wasn’t physical enough.

But a player, who agreed they weren’t, said it was never a message the coaching staff hammered home every day. As strange as it sounds, if a coaching staff isn’t constantly focusing and reminding players how they should play, then the players won’t play that way.

The messages to the players have been clearer and right now they are being hammered home on a daily basis, and I’d expect that to continue all season. The players who buy in will play, and those who don’t won’t play and ultimately won’t be here very long.

This power struggle will be won by the coaching staff, and for some veterans and young players, they'd better realize that quickly.

The best fight I saw today

Who would have thought the best fight of the pre-season would have occurred at practice, and at Eskimo practice?

After leaving Rexall I went to watch the Eskimos practice and I witnessed the most one-sided football tilt I’ve seen in a long time.

During scrimmage, O-lineman Aaron Fiacconi and D-lineman Xzavie Jackson got into it. They threw some punches and then Fiacconi showed his hockey background: he ripped off Jackson’s helmet, pulled his head down and fed him two huge uppercuts, the second one dropped Jackson.

Jackson picked himself up off the turf and stormed off to the sidelines. Meanwhile Fiacconi went back to the huddle and got ready for the next play. Not one player said anything to Jackson. He was on the far sidelines, and then he proceeded to throw off his gloves, take off his practice jersey and walked towards the north end zone of Clark field. He walked across the endzone and towards the gate. Only receiver Maurice Mann came over to try and get him to not leave practice. Jackson barked something to him, and then proceeded to continue walking towards the dumpsters.

Thirty seconds later he returned with a shovel that he had found. He was slowly walking back towards the field when trainer TD Forss and Danny Maciocia stopped to talk to him. Jackson was visibly upset, and after some talking he left towards the locker room with Forss.

His left eye was swollen shut and had a cut on it. The strangest part for me wasn’t that he found a shovel and contemplated going WWE on someone, but that not one of his defensive teammates did anything on the field, or said anything to him on the sidelines.

Their silence told me he isn’t that respected in the locker room and I can’t see him sticking around very long. Rarely is a football fight more entertaining than a hockey fight.

***UPDATE***

I got some confirmation that the Oilers and Predators are kicking each other tires. Nilsson would seem like an obvious choice, but I've heard whispers about Pouliot and Pisani as well. Nashville has lots of cap space if they want to acquire either Pisani or Nilsson.

I know the Oilers have lots of D-men, but would Hamhuis be of interest to them? We'll see.

It sounds like there might be some interesting names across the NHL that might land on waivers as early this weekend.

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One of Canada's most versatile sports personalities. Jason hosts The Jason Gregor Show, weekdays from 2 to 6 p.m., on TSN 1260, and he writes a column every Monday in the Edmonton Journal. You can follow him on Twitter at twitter.com/JasonGregor
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#351 Archaeologuy
September 25 2009, 12:19AM
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David S wrote:

Absolutely correct. Problem is, you’re making gi-normous judgment calls based on a few exhibition games. In a normal pro team, prospects have to be STELLAR to break in. Not just OK. Because everybody knows that it takes more than a few times at bat before the true gauge of an athlete can be made. Hey, I don’t doubt we have some major problems, but subbing in a bunch of green punks isn’t going to make it any better. The way to do it is to be selective and let the rest mature somewhere where they aren’t going to cost us points.

I'm not disagreeing with your premise. I'm not suggesting the team axes Hemsky and inserts Eberle. The suggestion was to get rid of some bottom 6 forwards and a 7th defenseman. And to replace them? A guy who already has killed penalties at the NHL level (Reddox) and some younger guys to take up the 13th and 7th spot. Honestly, i havent fiddled with the Powerplay, the top 6 forwards, the regular defense corp, or the goaltender. The team would be exactly as it would be every night Except perhaps 2 players who are on the decline of their careers. That is it. Perspective. goodnight.

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#352 EddieEdmonton
September 25 2009, 12:19AM
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jacques would be better then pisani and probably wil this year cogs could do his work on the pk and is faster too comrie as well i dont understadn this he kills penalties talk ok we were ranked 27th last year all hail pisani what were we the year before? all hail pisani?

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#353 David S
September 25 2009, 12:20AM
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Worse yet. If Pisani is as bad as some say he is, what makes you think a NHL GM who assesses players for a living isn't going to see the same thing. He'd have to be an idiot. Its not like we can get rid of our trash so easily.

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#354 RossCreek
September 25 2009, 12:21AM
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The way I see it, there's at least 1 guy making 2+ mil that is on the outside looking in for the top 12 F (Nilsson/Moreau/Pisani being the 1). If they can at least open up that 2+ they will be sittin alright cap-wise. (If they could move 2 or even all 3 and replace them with 2 younger and/or cheaper veterans, they'd be sittin pretty. They need to close the age-gap and add some late 20's vets to the core in their place)

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#355 ScubaSteve
September 25 2009, 12:24AM
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EddieEdmonton wrote:

JFJ will send Stortini on waivers

Are you drunk, or just touched in the head? Stortini and JFJ are not competing for the same spot. They can both make the team, and I hope they do. I'd like to see JFJ on the 3rd, and Stortini on the 4th.

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#356 David S
September 25 2009, 12:25AM
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RossCreek wrote:

They need to close the age-gap and add some late 20’s vets to the core in their plac

Agreed. Problem is, those late 20's vets have to be at least as good as the guys we give up. And they might not be any cheaper, unless we get another Comrie.

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#357 RossCreek
September 25 2009, 12:28AM
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@ David S: Yes, this is where my Chimera parade comes in. I thought they made a mistake in getting rid of him. He's 3 or 4 years younger than Moreau or Pisani and comes in @ 1.875. A perfect fit.

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#358 Porter
September 25 2009, 12:31AM
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EddieEdmonton wrote:

@ Porter: brule jacques sulllivan comrie cogliano

O'Sullivan/Comrie are the only players there with any real NHL PK experience. Cogliano sure was stellar on the PK last year, just like the rest of the Oil.

The Oilers were killing a penalty when they lost the game tonight, correct? My bet is Pisani would have been a much better match up off the draw and we would have gone to a shootout.

He brings great defensive awareness and you sell that sooooooo short.

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#359 David S
September 25 2009, 12:32AM
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RossCreek wrote:

@ David S: Yes, this is where my Chimera parade comes in. I thought they made a mistake in getting rid of him. He’s 3 or 4 years younger than Moreau or Pisani and comes in @ 1.875. A perfect fit.

RC- The guys on the team were saying no way Chimera wants to come here. Zero chance.

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#360 Chris
September 25 2009, 12:33AM
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@ ScubaSteve:

I've been rooting for JFJ for years. He's everything that Schremp is not: big, physical, fast, and a PPG player in the AHL. Jacques played 37 games for the Oil down that terrible strech in 07 (around the time Smyth was traded) and could never get his offensive game on track. (Kinda like EVERY other Oiler during that stretch)

Since then, Jacques has had a series of problems with his back, and when healthy, played only sporadically in the NHL as a fourth liner. Quinn's fresh eyes have identified ignored potential and I'm excited to see if Jacques can evolve into a bona fida NHLer and power forward.

He's the kind of player who deserves a good long look.

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#361 RossCreek
September 25 2009, 12:34AM
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@ David S: Ya I heard that. Earlier in the day Gregor said now that MacT is gone, Chimera would be open to returning. I'm guessing Wil & Corey didn't know that, but I've heard before that Chimera didn't have any interest returning under MacT.

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#362 RossCreek
September 25 2009, 12:38AM
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@ David S: From the other thread earlier today... Jason Gregor wrote:

RossCreek wrote: @ Gregor: Did I hear you say Columbus is looking to dump Jason Chimera? IMO, he’d be a better fit (style/age/salary) than Pisani (or even Moreau). They offered him for Erhroff this summer, but it didn’t happen. The Oilers can’t take any players until they dump some. I do like Chimera now that he is consistent, and with MacTavish gone he would be open to returning home.
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#363 RossCreek
September 25 2009, 12:40AM
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Heck, I'd take Torres over some of these vets too. Not sure how Joe OilFan feels about that statement

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#364 Chris
September 25 2009, 12:57AM
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This was probably adressed earlier in the thread but:

The TSN panel offered some pretty stinging critism of the makeup of the Oiler roster. I can't say I disagree. The Oilers have too many of the same type of player... Like Barnaby said, "They look almost interchangeable out there"... then something like, "Having a small skilled player or two is great if they are scoring seventy or eighty points a season, but filling out the bulk of your roster with a bunch of small guys who get you only forty points is a recipe for disaster." *(not an actual quote... more of a remembered jist)

This entire thread has been about Pisani, Staios, Moreau, or any other goat du jour... but aren't we all ignoring the principal flaw of this team? When will Tambellini choose between Gagner and Cogliano? Or is it wise to keep both? If O'Sullivan and Comrie play well together, should Tambellini offer Comrie an extension? How do the Oilers integrate Eberle into an already undersized group next season? Is Brule and Reddox just more of the same... I mean gritty or not these guys just bounce off thier checks...

Just food for thought.

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#365 cableguy
September 25 2009, 06:54AM
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RossCreek wrote:

That is false. If you have 3 mil in cap space now, come Jan/Feb, you have the space to add 6 mil. May come in handy.

do you keep 3mil free on the chance you can add salary?

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#366 Petr's Jofa
September 25 2009, 06:54AM
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Chris wrote:

When will Tambellini choose between Gagner and Cogliano?

July 1st, 2009.

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#367 cableguy
September 25 2009, 07:11AM
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Petr's Jofa wrote:

July 1st, 2009.

so he made the choice already and is keeping it secret?

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#368 cableguy
September 25 2009, 07:12AM
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cableguy wrote:

so he made the choice already and is keeping it secret?

unless you are referring to the heatley deal that fell through.

that said, we have no idea if a similar deal involving gagner has been talked about either

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#369 RossCreek
September 25 2009, 08:09AM
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cableguy wrote:

RossCreek wrote: That is false. If you have 3 mil in cap space now, come Jan/Feb, you have the space to add 6 mil. May come in handy. do you keep 3mil free on the chance you can add salary?

Do you lock yourslef in and not even have the "chance" to add salary?

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#370 LBH
September 25 2009, 08:09AM
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sorry guys, there are 8 pages of convo that i'm not willing to read.

would it be plausible that NSH takes 2 of Pisani, Nilsson, MAP?

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#371 David S
September 25 2009, 08:37AM
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LBH wrote:

sorry guys, there are 8 pages of convo that i’m not willing to read. would it be plausible that NSH takes 2 of Pisani, Nilsson, MAP?

I think your ahe answer is somewhere between pages 4 and 7.

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#372 David S
September 25 2009, 08:37AM
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^ forget "ahe". WTF was that?

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#373 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 08:43AM
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RossCreek wrote:

cableguy wrote: RossCreek wrote: That is false. If you have 3 mil in cap space now, come Jan/Feb, you have the space to add 6 mil. May come in handy. do you keep 3mil free on the chance you can add salary? Do you lock yourslef in and not even have the “chance” to add salary?

That's to simply of a way to look at it.

Do you clear salary and make yourself worse (I know that's another debate... but I'll bet three respected hockey minds with roughly 100 years in NHL experience are going to agree with me) for 60 games, because you might be able to make yourself better for the last 20? If we were SJ (where at this point the regular season doesn't really matter) then you could probably argue that you should. When your a bubble team that NEEDS the PO, you don't have those 60 games to play with.

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#374 Archaeologuy
September 25 2009, 08:52AM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Do you clear salary and make yourself worse

The team isnt worse if they can clear salary without losing effectiveness, and with that cleared salary they can afford the faceoff winning centre or, god forbid, a top 6 forward.

Even if Tambellini got rip-roaring drunk and made every change that I suggested the Oil would still have 50 million on their payroll. The difference is that they could fill the obvious holes on their team via trade or free agency all while only changing bit role players.

I will still never understand your desire to tie all the available money up on guys who, history has proven, cant get it done.

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#375 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 08:57AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Do you clear salary and make yourself worse The team isnt worse if they can clear salary without losing effectiveness, and with that cleared salary they can afford the faceoff winning centre or, god forbid, a top 6 forward. Even if Tambellini got rip-roaring drunk and made every change that I suggested the Oil would still have 50 million on their payroll. The difference is that they could fill the obvious holes on their team via trade or free agency all while only changing bit role players. I will still never understand your desire to tie all the available money up on guys who, history has proven, cant get it done.

Because you are a$$ backwards in your thinking. You don't cut guys lose and then sign replacements. You sign guys (like they did with Comrie... who will likely spell the end of Nilsson) and then make the cuts to get under the cap at camp.

The little money games fans play are over in a week and a half, once you go into the season you keep a little cash for injury call ups and maybe a little for a rental, that's it.

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#376 The Menace
September 25 2009, 09:09AM
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David S wrote:

Gotta say. The MTS Centre looks like a pretty decent rink.

I was thinking the same thing. NHL Hockey does not look out of plalce there, like it did in Saskatoon. Wouldn't getting 14k or 15k per game at the MTS Centre be better than the 8-10k that arenas down south draw? I would imagaine the average price per ticket would be much higher too.

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#377 Archaeologuy
September 25 2009, 09:09AM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Because you are a$$ backwards in your thinking. You don’t cut guys lose and then sign replacements. You sign guys (like they did with Comrie… who will likely spell the end of Nilsson) and then make the cuts to get under the cap at camp.

You mean like how JFJ and others have outplayed Vets like Pisani and Moreau in the preason? Is that what you mean? You mean have a camp where everyone competes for spots and then give those spots to the best guys in camp? They should totally do that.

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#378 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 09:09AM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Archaeologuy wrote: Ogden Brother wrote: Do you clear salary and make yourself worse The team isnt worse if they can clear salary without losing effectiveness, and with that cleared salary they can afford the faceoff winning centre or, god forbid, a top 6 forward. Even if Tambellini got rip-roaring drunk and made every change that I suggested the Oil would still have 50 million on their payroll. The difference is that they could fill the obvious holes on their team via trade or free agency all while only changing bit role players. I will still never understand your desire to tie all the available money up on guys who, history has proven, cant get it done. Because you are a$$ backwards in your thinking. You don’t cut guys lose and then sign replacements. You sign guys (like they did with Comrie… who will likely spell the end of Nilsson) and then make the cuts to get under the cap at camp. The little money games fans play are over in a week and a half, once you go into the season you keep a little cash for injury call ups and maybe a little for a rental, that’s it.

I should highlight the "and then TRY to sign replacements"

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#379 RossCreek
September 25 2009, 09:21AM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Do you clear salary and make yourself worse

Are those two things connected? Do you think having Robert Nilsson, for example, is the difference in playoffs or no playoffs? What IF Atlanta decides to move Kovalchuk at the deadline... but the Oil stayed a cap team all season? Now they can't even get in on him without Atlanta taking significant salary back. You never know what pops up. There's no trophy for playing the season with 4 mil of cap space free'd up... but there's also no trophy for spending every penny you can.

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#380 Chris
September 25 2009, 09:22AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Even if Tambellini got rip-roaring drunk and made every change that I suggested

He'd have to be.

*rimshot*

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#381 Chris
September 25 2009, 09:23AM
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RossCreek wrote:

What IF Atlanta decides to move Kovalchuk at the deadline… but the Oil stayed a cap team all season?

It dosen't take long to dump salary via waivers.

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#382 Archaeologuy
September 25 2009, 09:24AM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Because you are a$$ backwards in your thinking. You don’t cut guys lose and then sign replacements. You sign guys

*HEAD EXPLODES INTO A STEAMING GOO

how do you plan on signing guys when the team is against the cap?

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#383 RossCreek
September 25 2009, 09:24AM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

once you go into the season you keep a little cash for injury call ups and maybe a little for a rental, that’s it.

~Worked well for the Flames down the stretch last year~

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#384 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 09:24AM
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RossCreek wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Do you clear salary and make yourself worse Are those two things connected? Do you think having Robert Nilsson, for example, is the difference in playoffs or no playoffs? What IF Atlanta decides to move Kovalchuk at the deadline… but the Oil stayed a cap team all season? Now they can’t even get in on him without Atlanta taking significant salary back. You never know what pops up. There’s no trophy for playing the season with 4 mil of cap space free’d up… but there’s also no trophy for spending every penny you can.

I'm not talking about Nillson here, and I'd be getting rid of Nillson because we have 5 other Nillson's that are all better.

For Kovalchuk we'd need about 1.7 million in space, that is resonable.... however another conversation, what's it going to cost you for Kovalchuk... even as a rental? Take the Hossa/Forsberg package and add to it. ie next years first+++. Do we want to give that up for 17 games and a round of playoffs?

Basically what I'm saying is you don't knowingly downgrade because you MIGHT be able to upgrade later.

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#385 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 09:26AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Because you are a$$ backwards in your thinking. You don’t cut guys lose and then sign replacements. You sign guys *HEAD EXPLODES INTO A STEAMING GOO how do you plan on signing guys when the team is against the cap?

Are you serious? Do you know that Ott was over the cap all summer? You sign guys over the summer, you adjust your roster at camp... their are no big name FA's available right now... and the ones that are can be accomidated by putting the Brule's and MAP's of the team in the minors.

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#386 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 09:27AM
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Chris wrote:

RossCreek wrote: What IF Atlanta decides to move Kovalchuk at the deadline… but the Oil stayed a cap team all season? It dosen’t take long to dump salary via waivers.

I don't get how these guys can't grasp this, you improve first, cut salary second. You don't cut salary and then hope to improve.

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#387 RossCreek
September 25 2009, 09:28AM
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Chris wrote:

It dosen’t take long to dump salary via waivers.

IF someone else picks the player(s) up OR if your owner will continually bury $ in the minors. Katz may not mind burying 2 mil for 1 player. But do you think he really wants to bury 3 guys at 2 mil? Does he like to waste $ like that? Is that how he got rich? There is one reason to be a cap team - your a contender. Period. Point...Blank...Period!

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#388 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 09:29AM
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RossCreek wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: once you go into the season you keep a little cash for injury call ups and maybe a little for a rental, that’s it. ~Worked well for the Flames down the stretch last year~

So one team in 4 years?

Question, if they were able to bring up 3/4 warm bodies from the AHL, do you think they win enough games to take the division?

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#389 Archaeologuy
September 25 2009, 09:31AM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Are you serious? Do you know that Ott was over the cap all summer? You sign guys over the summer, you adjust your roster at camp… their are no big name FA’s available right now… and the ones that are can be accomidated by putting the Brule’s and MAP’s of the team in the minors.

Ok so I guess the Oilers have to wait until next year to get better. October starts and the team is set in stone, but not ryan stone because he's not moreau.

Ogden Brother wrote:

I don’t get how these guys can’t grasp this, you improve first, cut salary second. You don’t cut salary and then hope to improve.

And i dont get how you seem to have this image of GMs only doing one thing at a time, as if negotiating with a free agent precludes them from puting a guy on waivers at the same time.

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#390 Chris
September 25 2009, 09:31AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

You mean like how JFJ and others have outplayed Vets like Pisani and Moreau in the preason? Is that what you mean?

JFJ will get a roster spot... so what's the problem?

Archaeologuy wrote:

You mean have a camp where everyone competes for spots and then give those spots to the best guys in camp? They should totally do that.

Are you saying the Oilers should dump Hemsky and his four million dollar cap hit and give his spot to Eberle based on a few pre-season games? I mean Eberle, O'Sullivan, and Comrie have clearly outperformed Hemsky at camp... Behold Edmonton: Your new first line!

Arch. You surprise me.

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#391 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 09:31AM
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RossCreek wrote:

Chris wrote: It dosen’t take long to dump salary via waivers. IF someone else picks the player(s) up OR if your owner will continually bury $ in the minors. Katz may not mind burying 2 mil for 1 player. But do you think he really wants to bury 3 guys at 2 mil? Does he like to waste $ like that? Is that how he got rich? There is one reason to be a cap team – your a contender. Period. Point…Blank…Period!

Why do you keep bringing up 6+ million

"But do you think he really wants to bury 3 guys at 2 mil?"

Their aren't 6 million $ FA's out there right now!!

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#392 Ogden Brother Jr.
September 25 2009, 09:34AM
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@ The Menace: 11,000 is what they had yesterday. Doesn't seem that good.

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#393 RossCreek
September 25 2009, 09:35AM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

I don’t get how these guys can’t grasp this, you improve first, cut salary second. You don’t cut salary and then hope to improve.

I'm not suggesting that you knowingly make your team worse to open up cap room. But if you can create cap room without losing any real value to the team, its a no-brainer. Pisani @ 2.5 or Rob Niedermeyer (to pick a name out of thin air) at under a milli? Is Nilsson's value to the team 2 mil - no, so ditch him, WHAMMO! 2 mil in cap space. Are they worse, no. You can't get rid of Pisani/Moreau for Stone (sorry Arch). Ya it saves $ but now you ARE degrading yourself. But you can replace Pisani/Moreau with younger, cheaper vets... and that creates cap space while keeping the team just as, if not more competetive moving forward.

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#394 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 09:35AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Are you serious? Do you know that Ott was over the cap all summer? You sign guys over the summer, you adjust your roster at camp… their are no big name FA’s available right now… and the ones that are can be accomidated by putting the Brule’s and MAP’s of the team in the minors. Ok so I guess the Oilers have to wait until next year to get better. October starts and the team is set in stone, but not ryan stone because he’s not moreau.

Their talent evaluaters need to decide if the handful of FA's still available are better then the role players they have. If they feel they are, then they can make adjustments.

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#395 Chris
September 25 2009, 09:36AM
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RossCreek wrote:

IF someone else picks the player(s) up OR if your owner will continually bury $ in the minors. Katz may not mind burying 2 mil for 1 player. But do you think he really wants to bury 3 guys at 2 mil? Does he like to waste $ like that? Is that how he got rich? There is one reason to be a cap team – your a contender. Period. Point…Blank…Period!

No... but Katz might be willing to pay NHL dollars for a player or two to play in the minors if it means he can snag Kovalchuk... Remember, he'd only be paying for twenty games or so if this all went down at the trade deadline.

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#396 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 09:36AM
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RossCreek wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: I don’t get how these guys can’t grasp this, you improve first, cut salary second. You don’t cut salary and then hope to improve. I’m not suggesting that you knowingly make your team worse to open up cap room. But if you can create cap room without losing any real value to the team, its a no-brainer. Pisani @ 2.5 or Rob Niedermeyer (to pick a name out of thin air) at under a milli? Is Nilsson’s value to the team 2 mil – no, so ditch him, WHAMMO! 2 mil in cap space. Are they worse, no. You can’t get rid of Pisani/Moreau for Stone (sorry Arch). Ya it saves $ but now you ARE degrading yourself. But you can replace Pisani/Moreau with younger, cheaper vets… and that creates cap space while keeping the team just as, if not more competetive moving forward.

Yes, that's all fine. But what most of these other guys are talking about is waiving the vets and replacing them with Stone/Eberle etc, read back.

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#397 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 09:37AM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

RossCreek wrote: Ogden Brother wrote: I don’t get how these guys can’t grasp this, you improve first, cut salary second. You don’t cut salary and then hope to improve. I’m not suggesting that you knowingly make your team worse to open up cap room. But if you can create cap room without losing any real value to the team, its a no-brainer. Pisani @ 2.5 or Rob Niedermeyer (to pick a name out of thin air) at under a milli? Is Nilsson’s value to the team 2 mil – no, so ditch him, WHAMMO! 2 mil in cap space. Are they worse, no. You can’t get rid of Pisani/Moreau for Stone (sorry Arch). Ya it saves $ but now you ARE degrading yourself. But you can replace Pisani/Moreau with younger, cheaper vets… and that creates cap space while keeping the team just as, if not more competetive moving forward. Yes, that’s all fine. But what most of these other guys are talking about is waiving the vets and replacing them with Stone/Eberle etc, read back.

I've said many times Moreau/Staios/Pisani are more then expendable if 27 year old versions of them are coming in.

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#398 RossCreek
September 25 2009, 09:38AM
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Ogden Brother wrote:

Question, if they were able to bring up 3/4 warm bodies from the AHL, do you think they win enough games to take the division?

We'll never know that. Does it give the premier players an extra shift to rest here or there... yes. Does that keep em fresh enough for an explosive shift later in the game... yes. Do I think the Flames F'd up... not really, they got unlucky. Did it cost them... who knows. But it sure woulda been nice to not have that question sitting, lingering in the back of your mind.

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#399 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 09:39AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: I don’t get how these guys can’t grasp this, you improve first, cut salary second. You don’t cut salary and then hope to improve. And i dont get how you seem to have this image of GMs only doing one thing at a time, as if negotiating with a free agent precludes them from puting a guy on waivers at the same time.

Because that isn't what you were suggesting that started this, read back. You want to dump and replace with unknowns.

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#400 Ogden Brother
September 25 2009, 09:40AM
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RossCreek wrote:

Ogden Brother wrote: Question, if they were able to bring up 3/4 warm bodies from the AHL, do you think they win enough games to take the division? We’ll never know that. Does it give the premier players an extra shift to rest here or there… yes. Does that keep em fresh enough for an explosive shift later in the game… yes. Do I think the Flames F’d up… not really, they got unlucky. Did it cost them… who knows. But it sure woulda been nice to not have that question sitting, lingering in the back of your mind.

And then the next question: Do you keep Jokenin off your roster so you can call those AHL players up in case of injury?

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