Taylor or Tyler? 66 more days...

Jason Gregor
April 20 2010 06:17PM

2010 Home Hardware CHL-NHL Top Prospects Game

The Taylor or Tyler debate will rage for another 66 days until the Oilers draft one of them, but it won’t stop there and it will surely intensify over the next ten seasons, especially if one of them becomes much more proficient.

I respect the guys or gals who have chosen Hall or Seguin, because I hate fence sitters. Pick why you like one and defend it to the death. I find it interesting how TEAM HALL has used Kyle Turris as an example of why you should stay away from Seguin. Like I said, when you are battling your point, you reach for any example that can help you. Good on you TEAM HALL, although the Turris/Seguin comparison is a major stretch in my opinion.

Due to the position and style of how Hall and Seguin play it was only natural to see this debate morph into the Crosby v. Ovechkin argument. I don’t think Hall or Seguin will be as dominant as Crosby or Ovechkin, but you can make the comparison based on their position and style of play. Seguin is more like Crosby, while Hall is more dynamic like Ovechkin.

I’ve said for years that Ovechkin is my favourite player to watch, but I don’t think he is better than Crosby. Which resulted in these types of responses:

Hemmertime: I'd take Ovechkin any day over Crosby. Swap them cities and put OV with Malkin and company and maybe he has a cup ring.

Crosby has elevated his game this year adding goal scoring, however when OV wants to take over a game, his hitting, shooting and endurance puts him in a class of his own.

RubberTrout: Based on the fact that he is a better overall offensive player? Based on the fact that he is more physical? Lots of things. It isn't just scoring goals. Ovie makes his teammates better too you know. Just because you say Crosby is better doesn't mean that is the gospel truth.

Gents what makes you think Ovechkin is a better overall offensive player?

Career numbers for Crosby in 371 games played he’s averaged 1.36 pts/game. Ovechkin in 396 games averages 1.33 pts/game.

Ovechkin is a better pure goal scorer and is more physical. He should be, considering he is three inches taller and 30 pounds heavier, but is offensive game doesn’t produce more points and unlike Crosby, Ovechkin’s game hasn’t improved the last few seasons?

This past summer after winning the Cup, Crosby said he needed to be a better goal scorer and improve his faceoffs. And what does he do this past season? He ends up leading the league in goals, and was 55.7% in the dot. He also took the most faceoffs in the entire league. He impacts the game more than Ovechkin.

The argument that Crosby has Malkin and that makes him better is weak. Crosby doesn't PLAY regularly with Malkin. Ovechkin plays with Backstrom and look at their point totals the past two seasons. Do you think that Malkin is that much better than Backstrom??

Malkin tallied 190 points to Backstrom’s 189. Not much difference.

You guys suggest that Crosby has a better supporting cast, but the only major difference has been in goal. Marc Andre Fleury is clearly better than Theodore or Varlamov, but compare the offensive depth of the Capitals and Penguins and it favours the Capitals.

Penguins 2010 Capitals 2010
Crosby 109 Ovechkin 109
Malkin 77 Backstrom 101
Gonchar 50 Semin 84
Staal 49 Green 76
Guerin 45 Laich 59
    Knuble 53
    Fleischmann 51
       
Penguins 2009   Capitals 2009  
Malkin 113 Ovechkin 110
Crosby 103 Backstrom 88
Staal 49 Semin 79
Sykora 46 Green 73
Fedotenko 39 Laich 53

Crosby doesn’t have close to the offensive supporting cast that Ovechkin has, yet you claim Crosby has the advantage playing in Pittsburgh. I’d love to know what makes you think Fleury helps him produce more points? Fleury has given Crosby a better chance of winning, but the goalie doesn’t impact his offensive points. If anything you can say that Crosby plays a bigger role in his team’s success than Ovechkin does in Washington.

Ovechkin scores more highlight reel goals, and I think that has influenced many people into thinking he is the best player in the game. Ovechkin is the best goal-scorer, but he is not a better offensive player than Crosby. Offence is a combination of goal scoring and play making and Crosby is better at this stage of the game.

Crosby hones his skills in the off-season and his all-around game is far superior to Ovechkin’s. Ovechkin has a magnetic personality and his style of play is very entertaining and that’s what makes him so likeable, and probably why fans love him. Like I said, he’s my favourite player, but I don’t think he is the best player.

Both are great players and I’m more of a fan of Ovechkin's style of game, but if I want to win I'd pick Crosby first. His track record is better and his willingness to improve his game is much higher than Ovechkin’s. And in the NHL winning is the most important thing, and while Crosby doesn’t have the flair, personality or excitement of Ovechkin his game is more complete.

If you honestly think that 20 GMs would take Ovechkin ahead of Crosby you are sadly mistaken.

I also think that Hall’s bullish style makes him more attractive to many Oiler fans; as it should. This team could use a player like that, just like they could use a true #1 centre.

It should be a win-win situation for the Oilers, regardless of who they choose. But if the goal is to build a championship team, not just an exciting team, then leaning towards Seguin makes more sense.

Similar to why Crosby is a better -- not more exciting-- player than Ovechkin.

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One of Canada's most versatile sports personalities. Jason hosts The Jason Gregor Show, weekdays from 2 to 6 p.m., on TSN 1260, and he writes a column every Monday in the Edmonton Journal. You can follow him on Twitter at twitter.com/JasonGregor
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#151 Chris.
April 21 2010, 01:21PM
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@Aleslav Smidsky

When I consider Ovechkin's style of play... I wonder if he can sustain his game into his mid to late thirties. Is it a stretch to suggest that Crosby is more likely to have the better overall career?

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#152 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
April 21 2010, 01:25PM
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OILERSORDEATH wrote:

Well other than Tavares, look at the team Kane and Toews play on, look at who Stamkos plays with, and even Doughty has a pretty damn good team around him. Not taking anything away from them at all they are fantastic young players, but poor Gagner look who he's had to play with. I think he's doing just fine. He's not our savoir guys, but I think as the Oilers get better as a team as will Gags. Dont you think if he played on a Chicago or LA that he'd be toying with 70-80 pts?

Highly unlikely.

80 points would have put him 18th league wide.

70 points would have put him tied for 26th league wide.

80 points would put him second on both teams in scoring. (only 1 behind Kopitar)

Hell, even 70 points would have put him second on both teams in team scoring.

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#153 Aleslav Smidsky
April 21 2010, 01:26PM
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Chris. wrote:

When I consider Ovechkin's style of play... I wonder if he can sustain his game into his mid to late thirties. Is it a stretch to suggest that Crosby is more likely to have the better overall career?

I would say it's a stretch. Would you say its wishfull thinking? Just busting your balls.

Are you typing about the hits he throws? For the amount of hits Ovechkin gives, Crsoby probably takes. It will probably even it self out. Who knows what the future holds. Maybe a cup or two for Ovechkin and Olympic gold. Then I wonder what turn the arguements would take?

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#154 Petr's Jofa
April 21 2010, 01:31PM
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For anyone thinking of going to te draft, to watch Edmonton pick #1, West Jet has a huge 1 day sale and a flight from Edmonton to LA is about $150. Unfortunatley the wife won't let me fly from St John's.

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#155 Heavyd
April 21 2010, 01:32PM
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@Petr's Jofa

What are ticket prices?

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#156 Senator Theo
April 21 2010, 01:40PM
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@David Staples

I see your point (I also read your article), but I wonder how much interest a blog would receive if Team Fence was writing the articles and managing user input.

Part of the reason blogs like this are so popular is that they allow everyday people from different backgrounds to express themselves and share/argue points of view. It would be pretty vanilla to read blogs that refused to take a stand on anything and split everything down the middle. We're not making the pick, so it's OK if we're not experts on who's better: Hall or Seguin.

If you're arguing for Team Fence, count me down for Team Pick-a-side.

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#157 Chris.
April 21 2010, 01:42PM
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Aleslav Smidsky wrote:

I would say it's a stretch. Would you say its wishfull thinking? Just busting your balls.

Are you typing about the hits he throws? For the amount of hits Ovechkin gives, Crsoby probably takes. It will probably even it self out. Who knows what the future holds. Maybe a cup or two for Ovechkin and Olympic gold. Then I wonder what turn the arguements would take?

I don't have a crystal ball... but Crosby is already one Cup and an Olympic gold ahead of Ovechkin in the career race. Let's remember that Crosby is also nearly two years yonger than Ovechkin and is still improving his overall game... Despite this, Crosby already boasts similar career NHL point totals to the Russian phenom and outscored him this season.

It's my take that Crosby's style of game is more sustainable into his thirties. (Flat out guess) But; given that Crosby is younger, accomplished more, is still showing improvement, and plays a less reckless game... it a good bet that Crosby will have the better overall career.

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#158 Aleslav Smidsky
April 21 2010, 01:47PM
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@Chris.

I'll agree its a good bet. I personally wouldn't bet on it. It is a good bet considering Crosbys fortunate has been better of the two so far.

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#159 rubbertrout
April 21 2010, 01:54PM
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Senator Theo wrote:

Not me - I'm on team salad, and I hear people on team soup don't know what they're talking about.

Really? We should fight then!

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#160 Tips
April 21 2010, 01:56PM
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I'm not (yet) sold on Seguin, but something to consider,

All time NHL point leaders:

Wayne Gretzky - Centre Mark Messier - Centre Gordie Howe - Wing Ron Francis - Centre Marcel Dionne - Centre Steve Yzerman - Centre Mario Lemieux - Centre Joe Sakic - Centre Jaromir Jagr - Wing Phil Esposito - Centre Ray Bourque - D Paul Coffey - D Mark Recchi - Wing Stan Mikita - Wing Bryan Trottier - Centre Adam Oates - Centre Doug Gilmour - Centre Dale Hawerchuk - Centre Jari Kurri - Wing Luc Robitaille - Wing

So, out of the top 20 players (points wise) of all time, 12 are centre, 6 are wing, and 2 are defence. 8 of the top 10 are centre. That's not to say that Hall or Seguin will even close close to any of these guys in their respective careers, it seems evident with this (and other facts people have pulled on here and other sites) that centre may be the more important position in the long run.

With so little to separate these 2 players, and as much pulling the stats card bugs me, sometimes "pulling a Willis" may help break any tie.

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#161 Chickenplucker
April 21 2010, 01:57PM
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rubbertrout wrote:

Really? We should fight then!

I'm cool with you guys fighting but I need to clear something up first.

I'm on team fork so naturally I would side with team salad but then I started thinking it could be chunky soup and now I'm kind of on the fence.

please help

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#162 The Real Scuba Steve
April 21 2010, 02:22PM
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HALL.

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#164 Senator Theo
April 21 2010, 02:26PM
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rubbertrout wrote:

Really? We should fight then!

Team Crouton just called me and thinks we can all work together.

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#165 misfit
April 21 2010, 02:34PM
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If Crosby was in the same draft class as Ovechkin he would've gone 1st overall. He would've been taken ahead of Ovechkin because he's the better player, not because he's a centerman.

If Seguin is the better player, then take him. If not, take Hall. Why complicate things by making it a C vs W question? Just take the better player.

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#166 The Duke of Hafford
April 21 2010, 02:51PM
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I have been reading these boards for some time but have never posted. Dont know why I decided to today....guess I am just bored at work.

Anyhows, the Oilers have too many forwards under contract and some of them have to go. We have some decent looking forward prospects but seem to be short on the defensive prospects. I havent seen this trade scenario before but what about trying to make a trade with Nashville to land one of their defensive prospects like Jonathan Blum or Cody Franson for someone like Cogliano. Nashville needs scoring help and has lots of defensive depth.

Such a trade wouldnt help the Oilers out next season but I think we can all agree that a true rebuild isnt going to get done in one season. And moving a small forward (whose role will be on the third line) for a potential 4-5 defenseman is a smart trade in my books.

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#167 Dyckster
April 21 2010, 02:59PM
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misfit wrote:

If Crosby was in the same draft class as Ovechkin he would've gone 1st overall. He would've been taken ahead of Ovechkin because he's the better player, not because he's a centerman.

If Seguin is the better player, then take him. If not, take Hall. Why complicate things by making it a C vs W question? Just take the better player.

An astute team will also draft based on need, not just the BPA. Considering several insiders have labelled these guys 1 and 1A, we should be looking at need as much, if not more, than talent. And at this point from what I've seen and read, the Oilers need a quality centre more than they do a winger.

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#168 Senator Theo
April 21 2010, 03:03PM
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misfit wrote:

If Crosby was in the same draft class as Ovechkin he would've gone 1st overall. He would've been taken ahead of Ovechkin because he's the better player, not because he's a centerman.

If Seguin is the better player, then take him. If not, take Hall. Why complicate things by making it a C vs W question? Just take the better player.

I think the debate is not if they should take the best player, but projecting who will be the best player.

The argument about taking a C over a W is only if all other things are equal.

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#169 Aleslav Smidsky
April 21 2010, 03:08PM
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@Jason Gregor

If Ovechkin is a disaster in his own zone, what is the excuse for Crosbys +/- being worse?

OK, I'm comparing some stats/players here now. Rookie season, minus the players you mentioned. Crosby had; LeClair, Malone, Palffy. Ovechkin had; Halpern, Willsie, Clark. Ask 20 GMs which three they rather have at the time.

I not grossly underrating nothing. Ask 20 GMs who the better player is? IMO it is Malkin, taking nothing away from Backstrom.

If a player is dominant on his line, that would make the line dominant. Penguins have/had two dominant lines.

How is it unfounded? Looking through their line-ups the last few years, it appears so.

Knuble or Staal, which one do you take? Which one do you think 20 GMs take?

Outside of this years trade deadline, Penguins have always had a deeper more established team.

Has Ovechkins game gone down hill? Why isn't his game evolving? They don't take face-offs on the leftwing.

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#170 Tracie
April 21 2010, 03:10PM
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@The Duke of Hafford

Welcome!

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#171 rubbertrout
April 21 2010, 03:12PM
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@Jason Gregor

Crosby needed to evolve his game because he was getting most of his points from assists. Ovechkin was already getting both goals and assists.

Are you suggesting that Ovechkin hasn't evolved?. Crosby has improved in faceoffs and goals which are pretty easy to see stats wise. I think Ovechkin has made great strides on his play away from the puck. If he was such a disaster in his own end then I would expect his plus minus would be impacted more than it is. I know that you think that particular stat is overrated but look at his numbers.

I don't see how things are nearly as clear cut as you make them. There are plenty of people that would take Ovie first and plenty that would take Crosby. There are arguments for both. I disagree with you on this point but that doesn't mean that you are flat out wrong or that I am for that matter.

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#172 Senator Theo
April 21 2010, 03:17PM
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@rubbertrout

Ovechkin also has much better goal celebrations. I think this has been overlooked by some of the pro-Crosby's around here.

*closes door of office and does a hot-stick dance*

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#173 Team Hall
April 21 2010, 03:54PM
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You know, if we want to draft someone who will be responsible in their own end, maybe we could draft Horcoff, I hear he's real responsible. Hands up who knows if Stamkos is responsible in his own end? That's right, neither do I, because who cares, he scored 50 goals. 50 goals = who cares about his own end. Hall reminds me a bit of a young Stamkos, great one-timer.

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#174 Team Hall
April 21 2010, 03:57PM
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OK, I'm just gonna come out and say this: I think Bob Stauffer is a great analyst, excellent commentator, terrible at play by play. Absolutely bush league at play by play. Let's get him more analysis jobs, and hire someone with vocal training to do play by play. If I have to listen to him do play by play for 20 years, I'm going to join Rod Phillips in Phoenix.

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#175 Bucknuck
April 21 2010, 04:07PM
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@Aleslav Smidsky

Crosby and Staal do not play on the same line. You weaken your credibility with the comparison between Knuble and him.

You are underestimating how good Backstrom is. Backstrom plays on the first line against the toughest defense on each team. He also has to be Ovechkin's defensive conscience. That is what beefs up Ovechkins plus minus. Malkin gets second pairing since Crosby's line takes the toughest assignments.

I take Crosby over Ovechkin and I take Backstrom over Malkin if I was creating my dream team.

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#176 SirFozz
April 21 2010, 04:19PM
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Senator Theo wrote:

Ovechkin also has much better goal celebrations. I think this has been overlooked by some of the pro-Crosby's around here.

*closes door of office and does a hot-stick dance*

I prefer to do my "hot-stick dance" at home personally.

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#177 jeanshorts
April 21 2010, 04:28PM
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SirFozz wrote:

I prefer to do my "hot-stick dance" at home personally.

Everything is better with a buddy.

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#178 yegCopywriter
April 21 2010, 04:47PM
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Prendergast canned. *Like*

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#180 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
April 21 2010, 04:59PM
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Jason Gregor wrote:

Look at the Selke trophy finalists. Guys who are offensive and considered very good in their own zone. Ryan Kesler will probably win and he was +1.

Ovechkin's plus minus doesn't illustrate that he is a great defensive player.

An old Leclair, Palffy who weren't close to the player in their prime. Look at their points.

Crosby's teams have depth down the middle, but not wingers. Suggesting Crosby's point totals are inflated because of Staal and Palffy, or any other wingers is inaccurate.

Ovie's game has stayed the same, and Crosby has gotten better in many facets making him the better player, which is what I said from the beginning. Ovechkin can remain the best goal scorer, but you've yet to prove what makes him a better player.

I don't know if I'd say AO has stayed the same.

He's raised his PPG from 1.34 as a rookie to 1.51 this year.

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#181 Archaeologuy
April 21 2010, 05:12PM
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yegCopywriter wrote:

Prendergast canned. *Like*

*Gets application and cover letter typed up*

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#182 David S
April 21 2010, 05:22PM
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yegCopywriter wrote:

Prendergast canned. *Like*

+1

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#183 The Real Scuba Steve
April 21 2010, 05:31PM
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Prendergast canned, good riddance too bad only Kevin is going.

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#184 Bucknuck
April 21 2010, 05:53PM
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@OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F

I have two words to explain that:

Backstrom

Green

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#185 Alon
April 21 2010, 06:32PM
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To add fuel to fire TSN has, several times, quized NHL GM's about which palyer they would rather have, Crosby or Ovie and each and everytime Crosby wins with an overwhelming majority.

The reason? Probably because he's the better player.

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#186 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
April 21 2010, 06:53PM
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Bucknuck wrote:

I have two words to explain that:

Backstrom

Green

I have a hard time believing that. I'd say it has more to do with going from a 19/20 year old rookie to a 23/24 year old in the prime of his career.

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#187 Bucknuck
April 21 2010, 08:44PM
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OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F wrote:

I have a hard time believing that. I'd say it has more to do with going from a 19/20 year old rookie to a 23/24 year old in the prime of his career.

What is hard to believe about it?

You go from playing with marginal players to playing with elite offensive players. They complement each other very well. Is it hard to believe that playing with those high end players would increase point production by 15 to 20 percent?

He really broke out last year when he was playing with Semin, Backstrom and Green.

He doesn't get 60 goals if is playing with the folks he was in his rooke year.

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#188 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
April 21 2010, 09:54PM
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Bucknuck wrote:

What is hard to believe about it?

You go from playing with marginal players to playing with elite offensive players. They complement each other very well. Is it hard to believe that playing with those high end players would increase point production by 15 to 20 percent?

He really broke out last year when he was playing with Semin, Backstrom and Green.

He doesn't get 60 goals if is playing with the folks he was in his rooke year.

I don't believe it because I can give you countless examples of guys that went to better teams/line mates with little to no increase in offensive production (and in alot of cases decreases)

07/08 was AO's 65 goal season. That was Backstroms rookie year were he only had 69 points, Green put up a good 56 points but not the spectacular 73 and 76 points he had the last couple of years

To put it another way, Ovechkin scored (goals) at a MORE prolific pace when Backstrom was a below average 1st line center, then he did when Backstrom was an elite top 5 in the world center... that gives reason to question, does it not?

I'll see your AO boosted by Semin/Green/Backstrom and raise you Bill Guerin putting up .26 GPG/.59 PPG his last year with the last place NYI and then putting up .27 GPG/.6 PPG playing with the best player in the world.

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#189 Team Hall
April 21 2010, 11:13PM
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Crash, thought you might like this quote from GM Rutherford of Carolina on draft prospects:

Rutherford was asked what he looks for in a potential draft prospect.

"The skill level is the first thing," he said. "Certainly, with the game we have now, speed is so important. Hockey sense is always important but it seems like the players who come into the League with the extra speed are the players that succeed. Of course, the character of a player is also important but you can't always get a full understanding of the player in a half-hour to hour interview, but you get a little bit of a feel for him."

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#190 Aleslav Smidsky
April 21 2010, 11:48PM
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@Jason Gregor

Good for Ryan Kesler. I still can't see how Ovechkin is a liablity in his own end if he is +30.

You were the first to say Crosby was better in his own zone. I said I disagreed and call your arguements weak. I then used what I thought was a good stat in + -, and you discredited it and disagreed with it. So I'll ask you again, why Crosby is better then Ovechkin on defence? The fact that Ovechkin tends to cheat at times can't be used to call Crosby better on defence.

I did look at their points. They all would have finished 4-6 in scoring if they were on Washington, yet on Pittsburgh they were 5-8. In value and points most of Sidneys supporting staff has been better.

I didn't suggest his points came because of them.

Sure, you said that in that beggining. I just said, I disagree and that your arguements were weak. I also asked you a few questions which you chose to ignore.

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#192 Bucknuck
April 22 2010, 08:30AM
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OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F wrote:

I don't believe it because I can give you countless examples of guys that went to better teams/line mates with little to no increase in offensive production (and in alot of cases decreases)

07/08 was AO's 65 goal season. That was Backstroms rookie year were he only had 69 points, Green put up a good 56 points but not the spectacular 73 and 76 points he had the last couple of years

To put it another way, Ovechkin scored (goals) at a MORE prolific pace when Backstrom was a below average 1st line center, then he did when Backstrom was an elite top 5 in the world center... that gives reason to question, does it not?

I'll see your AO boosted by Semin/Green/Backstrom and raise you Bill Guerin putting up .26 GPG/.59 PPG his last year with the last place NYI and then putting up .27 GPG/.6 PPG playing with the best player in the world.

dammit Ogden Brother can't you just admit when I am right. You can't admit it so you have to make all kinds of sense and stuff. Just stop it.

OK fine. I even gave you props.

Ovechkin has improved. There, I said it.

But not as much as Crosby :-P

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#193 Jon
April 22 2010, 09:08AM
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Ovechkin and Crosby?

I can see Hall being an Ovechkin-lite....(very lite). But Seguin and Crosby not so much.

How about Malkin and Seguin though?

This one works bette for a couple reasons I think.

1. Ovy and Malkin were 1-2 in their draft year. Also many people said Ovechkin was better now, but Malkin could end up as good as him in the future when they were drafted.

2. Seguin's style of play is probably more similar to Malkin's. I think Crosby has much more of a board game and cycle game in his repertoire than either player. In terms of the board game, Seguin is a lot more similar to Malkin based on my viewings. Both Seguin and Malkin strike me as natural playmakers who can also put the puck in the net. And they both have had seasons where they've had close to twice as many assists, and then other seasons where they've had a very high number of goals.

Definitely think Hall and Seguin are much closer comparisions to Ovechkin and Malkin.

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#194 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
April 22 2010, 09:28AM
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Bucknuck wrote:

dammit Ogden Brother can't you just admit when I am right. You can't admit it so you have to make all kinds of sense and stuff. Just stop it.

OK fine. I even gave you props.

Ovechkin has improved. There, I said it.

But not as much as Crosby :-P

Ha-ha, just gotta make sure all the facts are laid out ;)

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#195 sauceboss
April 22 2010, 12:31PM
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Hemmertime wrote:

"The argument that Crosby has Malkin and that makes him better is weak. Crosby doesn't PLAY regularly with Malkin."

No, but having Malkin on a separate line stops the other team from playing their best checkers against Crosby all the time. They have more to focus on. Pittsburgh's depth has made Crosby appear better. For his first few years Ovechkin didnt have any teammates worth mentioning... and still beat 100 points. 65 goals in this day and age? Un-freaking-believable.

Crosby crossing 50 goal mark this season does a lot to add ammunition to his side of the argument, previous to this year he had never hit 40. He was a smaller version of Joe Thornton. Same time last year I believed Crosby wasn't even the best player on his team, when Malkin shows up and uses his size he is much more prolific than Crosby. Crosby should get more points than Ovie though because he is center. How many of his Assists are off faceoff wins?

But if I had to choose between them, I'll take Ovechkin, can play a 2.5 minute shift up tempo, hit, has 0.68 Goals per game in his career and the personality to keep fans enthralled. Really there is no wrong answer, Crosby does more to make players better around him - so lots of people would pick him - but as far as individual one versus one talent - Ovie.

All that being said: Today I'd draft Seguin. Tomorrow might be back to Hall. You say you admire those who can pick one and stick with it, but near impossible with these two. Each article you read or fact sheet makes you second guess it. I think Hall is more boom or bust (not a big bust though), either going to get an amazing winger, or could be a guy that falls to 2nd or third line through his career. Seguin I think is the safer bet, smart C who might not be your first if doesn't pan out, but will be a decent 2nd. Im hoping his peak isn't it: But I see his worst as David Legwand caliber.

From watching Pittsburgh games, it's clear that Crosby typically draws the other team's top defensive shut down line, so Malkin's presence does little to help his situation. If anything, Crosby's presence provides Malkin with the opportunity to go head to head with weaker lines the vast majority of the time. What depth are you referring to also, as demonstrated in the article, the Capitals are much deeper offensively and in terms of linemates, Knuble and Backstrom are significantly better than Guerin and Kunitz.

In terms of faceoffs, the fraction of points Crosby get off faceoffs is barely worth mentioning, players score very rarely from a faceoff and i anything, this would be offset by Ovechkin's league leading 5 empty net goals and likely more assists that come when the other team's goalie is pulled. Also, no player can play a 2.5 minute up tempo shift, it's not possible. He averages 66 seconds per shift and this is the highest in the league. However, I view this more as a negative aspect of his game as by staying on the ice longer, he disrupts his team's line combinations and clearly does not have the energy to play attentive defense at the end of such long shifts. If he would shorten his shifts he would still recieve the same ice time but would have more energy for each one.

Clearly, Ovechkin has a better transition game in terms of beating players on the rush one on one. But Crosby is more effective one on one in terms of coming out of the corner or playing down low. Ovechkin's a great player, but he's also in a great situation to put up points being on the highest scoring team in the league ( o.78 goals per game more than the pengins), I see him as being one of the top players in the league but I also believe that if you put Marian Gaborik or Ilya Kovalchuck in his situation they would put up similar numbers.

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#196 Gismo The Great
April 28 2010, 03:16AM
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For awhile ive been on the Seguin bandwagon because he seems like the better fit for the oilers in the long run.... but (and i know its not fair for Seguin seeing as his team is no longer in the playoffs and by no means its not because of lack of talent from Seguin's part)... seeing Hall and windsor not only comeback from 3-0 deficit and win.. Hall like many say is the more dynamic player and you cant help to notice the talent he's got.... these playoffs have only made it harder im sure for the oilers to decide which one to choose...

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