MAPLE LEAFS INTERESTED IN GAGNER?

Robin Brownlee
October 06 2011 10:34AM

Might circumstance and necessity make the Edmonton Oilers and Toronto Maple Leafs trade partners? Toronto Star columnist Damien Cox fuelled speculation today it might be so, citing "persistent chatter" the Maple Leafs are interested in Sam Gagner.

The Oilers are deep at forward and light on defensemen, while the Maple Leafs are relatively deep on the blue line but are looking to improve down the middle, which prompted Cox to mention via Twitter that this "persistent chatter" -- no word on who is actually doing the talking -- makes some sense.

Might there be common ground for a deal there?

DOES IT ADD UP?

Often-injured Tim Connolly, who was supposed to play centre on Toronto's the top line alongside Phil Kessel, is out with a bad shoulder and not expected to play in the Maple Leafs first two games, including the season-opener against Montreal.

Gagner, meanwhile, has been nursing a sprained ankle, so there's no guarantee he'd be ready any sooner than Connolly. In the longer term, however, GM Brian Burke might be looking for somebody like Gagner to bolster his top nine. Burke just added face-off specialist David Steckel, but he's a fourth-liner.

The Oilers have Ryan Nugent-Hopkins, Shawn Horcoff, Eric Belanger, Anton Lander and Gagner, when he's healthy, as centres. They also have Chris Vandevelde and Ryan O'Marra on the AHL farm.

While there are questions about Edmonton's blue line depth, especially with Ryan Whitney coming off ankle surgery and Ladislav Smid out with a separated shoulder, the Maple Leafs are heavy on the back end.

They have Dion Phaneuf, Carl Gunnarsson, John-Michael Liles, Luke Schenn, Mike Komisarek and rookie Jake Gardiner in their top six, with Cody Franson, Keith Aulie and Matt Lashoff, just sent to the minors, waiting in the wings.

Even if the Maple Leafs are interested in Gagner, as Cox says, it doesn't mean a thing unless Edmonton GM Steve Tambellini sees somebody in that group as a useful part on his blue line.

Listen to Robin Brownlee Wednesdays and Thursdays from 3 p.m. to 5 p.m. on the Jason Gregor Show on TEAM 1260.

Aceb4a1816f5fa09879a023b07d1a9b4
A sports writer since 1983, including stints at The Edmonton Journal and The Sun 1989-2007, I happily co-host the Jason Gregor Show on TSN 1260 twice a week and write when so inclined. Have the best damn lawn on the internet. Most important, I am Sam's dad. Follow me on Twitter at Robin_Brownlee. Or don't.
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#51 Dman09
October 06 2011, 12:41PM
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I think Franson is a very interesting guy to look at getting. Him being a 7th D right now could work in the favor of Edm. If Gagner and a 4th for Franson and a 2nd would get it done I'll all for it. You can have all the offense you want but if you can't stop people from scoring on you, you won't have a dominating team and that is the goal.

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#52 Quicksilver ballet
October 06 2011, 12:41PM
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Mr. Katz promised us a scorched earth type of rebuild. There are still some pieces left to be moved. Get`er done.

We have a few new trees breaking through the soil, lets plant two more come June.

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#53 derrickhands
October 06 2011, 12:45PM
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Robin you forgot one centre, Pitlick is centring the 1st line with the Barons.

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#54 Romanus
October 06 2011, 12:48PM
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Quicksilver ballet wrote:

Stick to the plan gentlemen. The only thing the Oilers need from Toronto is their first selection next summer. Perhaps that ends up somewhere in that 9-11 range. We should be able to add a roster player along with that pick to greatly improve on that second top ten selection.

Good idea. We can keep replacing veterans for prospects forever and keep the rebuild going for 20 more years.

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#55 Dman09
October 06 2011, 12:51PM
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@Dman09

better yet, we could sign Stralman, put chorney on waivers and keep gagner. I think that would be a great way. then later in the season if Lander and RNH out play gagner you could package another dman with gagner in a trade if you find a Dman you want.

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#56 gord962
October 06 2011, 12:54PM
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I have been saying this for a couple weeks now and hopefully we finally see something happen.

Why does so many people here think trading Gagner means we are giving up on him? All a trade like this says is that we are deep at the forward position and thin on defense. We will give you value in return for value.

It will take more than Ganger to get Schenn - Burke wouldn't include Schenn in the Kessel trade so he gave up Seguin isntead.

It will take more than Gagner and a 1st rounder to get Weber. Really, if you were Nashville would you make that deal?

I do agree with the idea of waiting until December to make a trade. We can give Gagner 1st line and #1PP minutes and boost his stats as much as possible. However, if he produces at a .75 point per game clip or better to increaes his value, the fans will really rip into Tambo for trading our top producing centre.

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#57 Archaeologuy
October 06 2011, 12:58PM
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Quicksilver ballet wrote:

Mr. Katz promised us a scorched earth type of rebuild. There are still some pieces left to be moved. Get`er done.

We have a few new trees breaking through the soil, lets plant two more come June.

It wasnt enough that the Oilers moved out their captain and every member of the core from the 06 run except Hemsky (who will probably be moved by the deadline) and the unmoveable Mr Horcoff?

Since the Cup Run the Oilers have selected 6th, 10th, 1st, and 1st, with a sprinkling of Jordan Eberle. Why the hurry to move out that 6th overall?

How on earth have you put Sam Gagner in the group of players that needs to be shipped out as part of the rebuild? What you're proposing is infinibuild: Where the Oilers have a revolving door of players drafted then subsequently traded before entering the prime years of their careers.

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#58 gord962
October 06 2011, 01:00PM
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Franson couldn't make the Leafs starting rotation. Why would we trade a 2nd line centre for a 7th d-man? We need a 1-2 dman so let's up the offer and get what we need. Gagner, Teubert and a high draft pick or two should deliver a stud blueliner.

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#59 gord962
October 06 2011, 01:03PM
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Dman09 wrote:

better yet, we could sign Stralman, put chorney on waivers and keep gagner. I think that would be a great way. then later in the season if Lander and RNH out play gagner you could package another dman with gagner in a trade if you find a Dman you want.

If Gagner is outplayed by RNH and Lander what do you think that does to his value? If he is outplayed by two rookies this year we will be lucky to get a 3rd round pick for Gagner.

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#60 Archaeologuy
October 06 2011, 01:04PM
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@gord962

It will be hard for him to be outplayed by Lander considering Lander has a ticket back to OKC as soon as Gagner is healthy.

EDIT: And based on that logic the Oilers paying a former 6th overall pick who happens to be their best offensive centre (for now) would be a gross overpayment for a 7th defenseman who has been outplayed in TO

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#61 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 06 2011, 01:04PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Somebody's wearing his argumentative pants today.

Slow work day.

Lots of misinformation floating around on here.

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#62 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 06 2011, 01:08PM
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gord962 wrote:

If Gagner is outplayed by RNH and Lander what do you think that does to his value? If he is outplayed by two rookies this year we will be lucky to get a 3rd round pick for Gagner.

I have a hard time believing Lander is going to up his production by 20%+ from the SEL to the NHL ... as a rookie.

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#63 Smokey
October 06 2011, 01:16PM
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Oilers have drummed up a bogus story to Damien Coxin order to maximize a return for Gagner. It tells you Gagner`s unfortunately on the block.

I could see Gunny or Aulie and a second, or another prospect outta Burkey, but the overated Schenn is Burkey`s love child, so this is a mute point.

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#64 gord962
October 06 2011, 01:16PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

It will be hard for him to be outplayed by Lander considering Lander has a ticket back to OKC as soon as Gagner is healthy.

EDIT: And based on that logic the Oilers paying a former 6th overall pick who happens to be their best offensive centre (for now) would be a gross overpayment for a 7th defenseman who has been outplayed in TO

Does anyone see that I was saying that this isn't going to happen in response to Dman?

DUH?

Also this that I wrote earlier: Franson couldn't make the Leafs starting rotation. Why would we trade a 2nd line centre for a 7th d-man?

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#65 kevcor
October 06 2011, 01:26PM
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Woogie wrote:

The problem with a trade with Gagner is we don't really have a top 2 centermen without Gagner.

sure RNH is a good #1 or #2 center but nobody else would fit. I'm not convinced Belanger is a top tier forward.

I would rather give up someone on the wing then down the middle.

I agree. As much as people say we are deep in the forward positions. I don't believe we are that deep at Center. We have Horcoff, Belanger, and Gagner (or Gagne as some people like to refer to him as) with any NHL experience. RNH and Lander might be excellent Centers in the future. But we can't think that the Oilers can contend withouth NHL Vets. Gagner is still very young with a lot of upside. And he has experience at the NHL level. We can't afford to trade him.

I feel we are a lot deeper on the wings. We have young players with skill. Trade one of those for an experienced Dman. Trade a young winger with a prospect and a draft pick or two for a dman if we can.

The Oilers aren't going to be contending for the cup this year. They still don't have a solid #1 center (RNH is the hope for that spot) so it doesn't make sense to trade away one our few NHL centermen. It will just make this team worse.

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#67 Bob Cob
October 06 2011, 01:47PM
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This is way of topic but those Spence Diamond commercials on the Team 1260 suck. Every time I hear one I want to punch something.

Oh, don't trade Gagner, you won't get the top end Dman for him. Use Hemsky as the trade bait for the top end dman.

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#69 DoubleJ
October 06 2011, 02:17PM
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I would like Franson, but not for Gagner. Jones and a pick for Franson? I think we could package Gagner for a bigger prize. Apparently NSH could be in a difficult position with Sutter and Webber. I would be trying to offer them a first round pick and Gagner for one of them. I don't like any of the TO guys enough for a Gagner swap.

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#70 Talbot17
October 06 2011, 02:27PM
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@DoubleJ

TO is filled with Jones' style players, why would they ever make that trade?

Maybe if were lucky enough, we can sign peter Chiarelli for a day, and get him to use his brain wash antics to sugar coat Gagner into being the second coming of Doug Gilmour, and shank Burke for Schenn and a first!

*pours new glass of ON kool aid**

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#71 John Chambers
October 06 2011, 02:37PM
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Whenever you consider making a deal you have to ask yourself: "What is the consequence if we DO NOTHING?"

Do nothing in this case would appear to me to be a compelling strategy for the moment. Although we need to start building the D post haste, and although Gagner might be a strong trading chip, the Toronto Maple Leafs don't seem to have the assets that would compel me to do anything.

Now Nashville is a different story.

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#72 bazmagoo
October 06 2011, 02:55PM
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Personally I think the Oilers would be wise to stay the course and land a top 2 d-man at the trade deadline. I'm ok watching a lot of 6-5 games this year, no matter if we win or lose.

But then again I'm not a panicked Oiler fan who has given up on the rebuild. I realize it is only about 1/3 to 1/2 complete. Finishing bottom ten this year will land us a solid d-man in the draft, combine this with flipping 1-2 forwards for a top 2 d-man at the deadline and our back line will start to look good.

If all that happens the only question mark will potentially be goaltending.

We can start competing for the playoffs next season, I'm more than fine with that.

Hall gets 35-40 goals this year, 65-70 points. Count on it!

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#73 Dog Train
October 06 2011, 02:57PM
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Gagner is still young and while he may need to be moved at some point in time, we will need to get back an equally young, inexpensive and promising dman. That eliminates: Dion Phaneuf, John-Michael Liles and Mike Komisarek. Burke will not trade Schenn and I don't see him moving Carl Gunnarsson or Jake Gardiner. I don't think he will trade Aulie but Franson or Lashoff might be in play. I could be wrong but I think that Lashoff needs to clear re-entry waivers to be brought back up anyways so I don't see us trading for him. Cody Franson does interest me. At least there is some logic to these rumours but given how meticulous Tambo tends to be in these situation, I don't think that anything gets done for a while yet, if ever.

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#74 bazmagoo
October 06 2011, 02:58PM
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DoubleJ wrote:

I would like Franson, but not for Gagner. Jones and a pick for Franson? I think we could package Gagner for a bigger prize. Apparently NSH could be in a difficult position with Sutter and Webber. I would be trying to offer them a first round pick and Gagner for one of them. I don't like any of the TO guys enough for a Gagner swap.

If Hemsky and Gagner both have solid season, combined with Omark looking like a potential Hemsky replacement, I figure you could flip both for Weber at the deadline.

When top 5 d-men are available, you should do what it takes to get them on your team. Even if it takes adding a 1st round pick in 2013, I'd be all over doing this deal.

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#75 Dog Train
October 06 2011, 02:58PM
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Gagner is still young and while he may need to be moved at some point in time, we will need to get back an equally young, inexpensive and promising dman. That eliminates: Dion Phaneuf, John-Michael Liles and Mike Komisarek. Burke will not trade Schenn and I don't see him moving Carl Gunnarsson or Jake Gardiner. I don't think he will trade Aulie but Franson or Lashoff might be in play. I could be wrong but I think that Lashoff needs to clear re-entry waivers to be brought back up anyways so I don't see us trading for him. Cody Franson does interest me. At least there is some logic to these rumours but given how meticulous Tambo tends to be in these situation, I don't think that anything gets done for a while yet, if ever.

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#76 Jordan Nugent-Hallkins
October 06 2011, 03:01PM
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@Bob Cob

Don't get me started on those Spence Diamond commercials. "Hurr yes... I will marry you. What's his name? I haven't met him yet!" I shudder violently with rage whenever I hear that 'Shawn' guy's voice.

On the subject of the Oil's D (or lack there of), I would like to see Tambo take a swing at Shea Weber for Gagner and a 1st, maybe throw in Hemsky if they aren't biting. Someone up above already said it: you gotta give quality to get quality.

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#77 stevezie
October 06 2011, 03:12PM
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Let me explain- no, there is too much. Let me sum up:

Is it too much to ask that if we trade Sam Gagner, we get back the D equivalent of Sam Gagner? I like Schenn, but Gunnarsson, Aulie, Franson? Fine players I'm sure, but do they have as much NHL experience combined as Sam? Does this team really need another project? You really think that's what we need, more unproven players and/or draft picks? Really? What this team lacks is a top 3 defenceman. We've got plenty of picks, plenty of youth, plenty of projects. Unless your proposed trade nets us a guy who is a top 3 D-man right now, it does not address our needs, it just shuffles a promising question mark from forward to defence.

Suggestions that Sam needs to go as part of the rebuild... strain credulity. Rebuilds load up on guys of his age and resume; the only reason we traded Cogs was we had too many centres, not because 22 is old. The earth has already been scorched. Good pre-seasons do not replacements make.

That said, Gord's point that trading Gagner (or Omark or Paajarvi or whoever) is not the same as giving up on them is well taken. We are strong(ish) on forward, weak on D. The move seems obvious, but you don't make it until you're offered something at least as good as what you're sending out.

EDIT: AUlie, Gunnarsson and Franson have slightly less combined NHL games than does Sam, they are the same age, one year and three years older than him and were drafted in the 3rd, 4th and 7th round. None of this is meant to be a shot at Robin for reporting it, I'm complaining about people convinced that THIS TEAM is somehow short on unproven youth, and yeah that includes draft picks.

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#78 bazmagoo
October 06 2011, 03:23PM
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I don't think trading Sam means that you are giving up on him, unless you trade him for draft picks. We did give up on Cogliano, and with good reason in my opinion.

Both guys have top 6 forward type skill sets, only one of them actually has the ability to make it work and that is Gagner.

Most teams would be better having Gagner as their second line centre, including us. If we traded Gagner for picks and/or prospect d-men I'd be the first to light up my torch and get in line for Tambo's head.

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#79 Quicksilver ballet
October 06 2011, 03:23PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

It wasnt enough that the Oilers moved out their captain and every member of the core from the 06 run except Hemsky (who will probably be moved by the deadline) and the unmoveable Mr Horcoff?

Since the Cup Run the Oilers have selected 6th, 10th, 1st, and 1st, with a sprinkling of Jordan Eberle. Why the hurry to move out that 6th overall?

How on earth have you put Sam Gagner in the group of players that needs to be shipped out as part of the rebuild? What you're proposing is infinibuild: Where the Oilers have a revolving door of players drafted then subsequently traded before entering the prime years of their careers.

C'mon Archie, i'm not saying move everyone of these guys, just make one deal follow by and teeney weeney second one. We'll still be stuck with the rest of that group.

6 lotto picks inside of 4 yrs and then add veterans to compliment this younger growing group. Rookies can easily do what these veterans are doing, they'd probably remain healthier as well. This would be nowhere near the infinity rebuild you bastages have mentioned.

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#80 stevezie
October 06 2011, 03:30PM
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Gagner is a lottery pick! The only reason he fell to #6 is the Kings took a flyer on Hickey. I didn't know why then and I don't know now.

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#81 stevezie
October 06 2011, 03:52PM
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I dunno Quickie, I'll agree that Gagner isn't untouchable, but you seem top want to move him for moving him's sake. He's got almost the same ppg as recent hero Logan Couture, and he earned those point on a much [swearword removed] team and has two more years experience. I don't hear anyone in San Jose clamouring to trade Logan.

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#82 Douche Nietzsche
October 06 2011, 04:02PM
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@Robin Brownlee

Thank You for the warm welcome and the reply, Robin.

I am strongly opinioned on most things I have a opinion on, and I am also a passionate Oilers fan. Sometime I play the devils advocate just for the sake of a discussion or to better understand the other point of view.

To be honest with you, I felt it was very disrespectful towards the Oilers to make this a big story just on the strength of hearsay. But to each is own, I guess.

Thank You again and keep on keeping on.

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#83 longbottom/P.Biglow
October 06 2011, 04:07PM
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@OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F

You might want to check them yourself. I checked the ten top centers 7(H.Sedin, J Thorton, P Datsyuk, C Perry, V Lecavlier, B Richards, M.Richards) the 5 year rule held true and 3(Crosby, Malkin, Stall) came in right away and scored 75+ points a year with in the five years. so thats 70% of the top ten centers in the league. Gagner isn't a top ranked center yet but he has also played 4 years. And of the 7centers named above Gagner ranked between Thorton at 44.8PPS and H Sedin at 34PPS Gagner at 43.2PPS.

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#84 Mitch
October 06 2011, 04:08PM
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Robin Brownlee wrote:

It seems obvious to me you've been intent on making a ripple here since signing up last Sunday. Good. Strong opinions are welcome. A few things, just so we get off on the right foot and you avoid getting your ass kicked out the door just as you're getting started.

While I'm late to Twitter, it's obvious to me its the new version of the office water cooler, only the group of people batting ideas and stuff around is global. If your remark about items from Ontario on Twitter is meant to suggest what I've written is bogus or coming from questionable places based on geography, you're mistaken.

Again, as yesterday, I'll cite a Toronto writer breaking the Chris Pronger trade request. Where the information comes from doesn't matter.

The exchange of info -- some of it good, some of it out of left field -- that used to take place only between reporters huddled in the rink or via e-mail and phone calls, is now on Twitter. Items that used to be contained in a short paragraph at the bottom of a sidebar or notebook, like "I'm hearing that . . ." are now on Twitter to get it out there right away in the name of timeliness. If you truly don't understand this, then educate yourself. If you're just being sarcastic to be a dick or to piss me off, then don't.

Brady and Cox, especially, are both working members of the media who cover sports in the Toronto market. Cox, like it or not, is very connected to what's happening with the Maple Leafs. They don't post stuff under fake names. While that doesn't mean what they say, hint at or speculate on is gospel or should not be questioned, repeating what they say isn't akin to trotting out "a friend of a girl who used to cut Sam Gagner's hair told me . . ."

-- In the original Brady item and in today's item about Gagner, please note question marks in the headlines.

-- In both items, note the word "speculation" in the very first paragraph.

-- In both items, I've attributed the information I passed along to those who generated the item, Brady and Cox, rather than throw out that "My information is . . ." or "According to sources . . ." thus making it sound like I uncovered something. While I like to be first with a story, nobody gets the inside line first all the time. When somebody else breaks something, or suggests something that might be in the works that impacts the Oilers, you pass it on and credit the person who came up with it. It generates interest, debate and discussion. That's what we do here.

Despite running items based on something I read on Twitter on back-to-back days, I have no intention of using it to replace good old-fashioned sniffing around. Twitter is a complement to that, just as advanced stats are to eye-balling what happens out on the ice.

If a fossil like me can change with the times and get the hang of this stuff, surely a smart, young person such as yourself can.

Or, like I said, maybe you were just being a dick. If that's the case, we won't even remember your fake name a month from now.

Welcome.

Robin when you post stuff it has credability, people can check your record.

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#85 Robin Brownlee
October 06 2011, 04:27PM
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Douche Nietzsche wrote:

Thank You for the warm welcome and the reply, Robin.

I am strongly opinioned on most things I have a opinion on, and I am also a passionate Oilers fan. Sometime I play the devils advocate just for the sake of a discussion or to better understand the other point of view.

To be honest with you, I felt it was very disrespectful towards the Oilers to make this a big story just on the strength of hearsay. But to each is own, I guess.

Thank You again and keep on keeping on.

I didn't make this a big story. It's only big if people care enough to read it and comment on it. I chose to pass on a Cox item. Our readers take it from there.

I'm trying to get a feel for what your game is here. Considering I gave you some razzing in my explanation, you've come back with a reasonable, calm response.

At the same time, we've got comments you've written today that won't be published because they're in all CAPS and laden with profanities directed at other people here. Is that playing devil's advocate?

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#86 Steelyma
October 06 2011, 04:31PM
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A touch off topic here the predetors sent Ryan Ellis to the minors.What would you give up for him to be an Oiler? I believe he would be an asset for the power play but not the punishing Dman we could use right now.I would give up Chorney and a 2nd round pick for him .I would love to see him grow with the other young kids in the system.I believe in three years he would be the quarter back of one of the bestpower plays in the league.

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Brownlee don't post crap

His articles are awesome

Don't anger Robin*

* I have first hand knowledge.

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#88 Thorn
October 06 2011, 04:36PM
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I must be missing a variable in this equation but why are so many people suggesting we trade Gagner, a 1st round pick, etc to get Shea Weber? He's signed to a 1 year deal right now and isn't he a UFA at the end of this season? I'm ALL FOR throwing everything AND the kitchen sink to land this pilar of confidence on the Oiler blue line, but not just for a year. We need this big bastard signed up for the long term so he's here when these kids turn into the scoring dynamo we all know they will be.

Right?

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#89 They're $hittie
October 06 2011, 04:37PM
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gord962 wrote:

If Gagner is outplayed by RNH and Lander what do you think that does to his value? If he is outplayed by two rookies this year we will be lucky to get a 3rd round pick for Gagner.

news flash gagner will not be outplayed by lander. and gagner in the line up is going to really help RNH along with easy minutes. Lander is horcoffs eventual replacement not gagners.

no one is comparing gagner to the sedins, they are comparing the situations. canucks fans were calling for them to be traded for years before they broke out, it took them five or six years in their career to break out, and they started at a year older than gagner

why trade the one center that you know what you got, what if nuge gets hurt or sent to red deer, probably wont get sent to red deer but than Lander has to carry the offensive load, wow that sounds lame

we are not going to win this year nor find an impact defensemen, hold on to gags for the year and move him next year if need be, once your prospects have had another year. gagner is a veteran and leader on this team despite his age. who better to teach lifestyle ways to teenager players than he, there is a large lifestyle difference with smythe and horcoffs age group compared to the hall group. Gagner is like more like a big brother.

kadri blows, nough said, toronto thinks he is going to be the next crosby, (yes I saw a toronto sun article saying we will be saying crosby ovechkin and kadri. Gagner has accomplished way more in his career, kadri doesnt even have one yet. good pick burke, just to spite ottawa, should have taken MPS.

If gagner does become a leaf, good bye kadri

Why did nashville (who knows defense) ship away franson for nothing, and he cant make the leafs. maybe he isnt that good. what does toronto know about defense, komisarek - overpaid, finger - terrible and over paid, schenn - not reached potential (yes hes young), phaneug - annually voted by peers as most over rated player in the league and overpaid

gagner for blum acceptable, but he is not impact yet either.

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#90 Clyde Frog
October 06 2011, 04:52PM
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I don't see it unless you are getting a REAL solid return on Gagner beyond a young project on D.

He is our most productive centre over the past few seasons, already has proven to ACTUALLY SCORE at a clip that justifies a 2nd line centre role.

The kids we have in the wings haven't proven a thing yet, sure they could step in and force the issue... But if they don't our top flight offensive centres sure look thin past RNH.

I would be happier trading a winger or waiting until we have a real battle for top 6 minutes in the centre position. But if we do have a deal for him it better be for a stud not a 4-6 plugger/project.

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#91 Max Powers - Team HME Evans
October 06 2011, 05:01PM
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RB:

What would you see Gagners value as in a situation like this? Is it closer to a 7-8 dman with potential to be better(Gardner or an Aulie) and a 2nd or is it closer to a 1st round pick + or a Schenn type(established top 4). It seems that people's opinion on what the return could be are varying widely.

I, personally, would think that Gagner's value would be closer to a 1st round pick, somewhere to be expected in the 9-15 range and a D prospect.

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#92 TKB2677
October 06 2011, 05:03PM
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Here is a question. Are we as Oilers fans overvaluing Gagner? Fact- He is at most 5'11, 180 lbs so a small center. Fact - He is terrible at faceoffs Fact- He is terrible defensively Fact - He has not broken 50 pts and have played 4 seasons in an offensive role including significant power play time.

Right now, Gagner is an ok second line center after playing 4 seasons. Could he develop into a 60 point guy? Maybe but in 4 seasons I don't think Gagner has improved his game much if at all since his rookie year. He keeps saying he has worked on his shot, skating, faceoffs, etc but where are the numbers to prove it? He is still terrible defensively, he is still terrible on faceoffs and has scored less points than his rookie year in each of the last 3 seasons. There is a very real chance that what you see with Gagner is what you are going to get. That's a little concerning to me.

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#93 HKYGUY82
October 06 2011, 05:07PM
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RB comments are always on point. It really doesn't matter what happens unless the brass start talking.

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#94 David S
October 06 2011, 05:14PM
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Max Powers - Team HME Evans wrote:

RB:

What would you see Gagners value as in a situation like this? Is it closer to a 7-8 dman with potential to be better(Gardner or an Aulie) and a 2nd or is it closer to a 1st round pick + or a Schenn type(established top 4). It seems that people's opinion on what the return could be are varying widely.

I, personally, would think that Gagner's value would be closer to a 1st round pick, somewhere to be expected in the 9-15 range and a D prospect.

~Because proven second-line NHL centers on the upside of their careers are SO not worth more than a first round pick "maybe" in the 9-15 range.~

Are you drunk? And I'm talking 10 beers and four shots in drunk.

Is everybody here so in love with the "rebuild" process now that you've totally forgotten what it's like to ice a competitive team?

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#95 Oilcruzer
October 06 2011, 05:22PM
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How come no one mentions Liles?

Now I have to watch the game to see what there is for talent on the Leafs.

Go Habs!

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#96 They're $hittie
October 06 2011, 05:26PM
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TKB2677 wrote:

Here is a question. Are we as Oilers fans overvaluing Gagner? Fact- He is at most 5'11, 180 lbs so a small center. Fact - He is terrible at faceoffs Fact- He is terrible defensively Fact - He has not broken 50 pts and have played 4 seasons in an offensive role including significant power play time.

Right now, Gagner is an ok second line center after playing 4 seasons. Could he develop into a 60 point guy? Maybe but in 4 seasons I don't think Gagner has improved his game much if at all since his rookie year. He keeps saying he has worked on his shot, skating, faceoffs, etc but where are the numbers to prove it? He is still terrible defensively, he is still terrible on faceoffs and has scored less points than his rookie year in each of the last 3 seasons. There is a very real chance that what you see with Gagner is what you are going to get. That's a little concerning to me.

maybe we are over valuing gagner but a few things here, he hasnt broken 50 points but he hasnt finished a season yet, when he does he we will be 55 points, scond we have no reason to trade him yet. Why because we draft RNH. He hasnt done anything yet. Second gagner has never enetered an nhl season under 190, dont know where you get 180 from (he is the same size as eberle). Hall, pajaarvi and eberle hvae not made 50 pts yet, how do we know they ar going to be so spectacular, (i agree they will but).

next i think everyone is concerned with dealing with burke. This is the guy that said he wanted to move up to draft tavares but wouldnt trade schenn, what else did he have but garbage. also how much did he want for kaberle, he finally move him because his hands were tied. Burke says he is righteous and does not offer ridiculous contracts and offer sheets. it may look this way but i just think he is not stupid enough to over pay on a big contract. But he is very disrespectful in his trade offers. I would like to pull one over on a few teams also but seriously, you were offering grabovski and your first for the pick that would become tavares. Screw off.

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#97 Max Powers - Team HME Evans
October 06 2011, 05:27PM
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@David S

1) I don't drink so if I'm drunk then there's a real problem... 2) Re-read and add a D prospect to that first round pick 3) I'm asking an expert because I really don't know and would like some insight on the matter, and you sir are not that expert that I was asking in the first place 4) Is a 1st rounder and a D prospect really that far off? You make it sound like Gagner would garner 3 first round picks or something...

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#98 Quicksilver ballet
October 06 2011, 05:36PM
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stevezie wrote:

I dunno Quickie, I'll agree that Gagner isn't untouchable, but you seem top want to move him for moving him's sake. He's got almost the same ppg as recent hero Logan Couture, and he earned those point on a much [swearword removed] team and has two more years experience. I don't hear anyone in San Jose clamouring to trade Logan.

I agree, it's not prudent to make a deal for the sake of making a deal. Just go out and get us something above and beyond what we're already due already. Going out and pursueing an extra lotto pick every 35 years shouldn't be impossible. One deal, one more deal we otherwise wouldn't receive as long as Steve continues to sit idly by. One deal that Steve Tambellini can put together on his own and in a yr or two, look himself in the mirror and say, i did that, the Edmonton Oilers are a better hockey club today because of something i (Steve Tambellini) had a hand in doing. He hasn't had to work very hard to have 4 and 93 land in his lap. I'd very much like to see him go out and do something extra, something above and beyond what they're already entitled to. Something substantial, a Kevin Lowe/Chris Pronger like, or a Brian Burke/ D and H Sedin type move.

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#99 David S
October 06 2011, 05:36PM
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Max Powers - Team HME Evans wrote:

1) I don't drink so if I'm drunk then there's a real problem... 2) Re-read and add a D prospect to that first round pick 3) I'm asking an expert because I really don't know and would like some insight on the matter, and you sir are not that expert that I was asking in the first place 4) Is a 1st rounder and a D prospect really that far off? You make it sound like Gagner would garner 3 first round picks or something...

Dude. You don't build a winning team by continually giving away your young, best players for dreams, magic beans and unicorns.

If, IF we were to trade Gagner, it better damn well be for a D-man of equal ability. Prospects and picks aren't even in that conversation.

It's like you'd be OK to trade Gagner for a high draft pick and Colten freaking Teubert (*spits*).

You must REALLY love losing.

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#100 bazmagoo
October 06 2011, 05:44PM
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Thorn wrote:

I must be missing a variable in this equation but why are so many people suggesting we trade Gagner, a 1st round pick, etc to get Shea Weber? He's signed to a 1 year deal right now and isn't he a UFA at the end of this season? I'm ALL FOR throwing everything AND the kitchen sink to land this pilar of confidence on the Oiler blue line, but not just for a year. We need this big bastard signed up for the long term so he's here when these kids turn into the scoring dynamo we all know they will be.

Right?

Weber is an RFA at the end of this year. He would be UFA at the end of the following season.

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