MAPLE LEAFS INTERESTED IN GAGNER?

Robin Brownlee
October 06 2011 10:34AM

Might circumstance and necessity make the Edmonton Oilers and Toronto Maple Leafs trade partners? Toronto Star columnist Damien Cox fuelled speculation today it might be so, citing "persistent chatter" the Maple Leafs are interested in Sam Gagner.

The Oilers are deep at forward and light on defensemen, while the Maple Leafs are relatively deep on the blue line but are looking to improve down the middle, which prompted Cox to mention via Twitter that this "persistent chatter" -- no word on who is actually doing the talking -- makes some sense.

Might there be common ground for a deal there?

DOES IT ADD UP?

Often-injured Tim Connolly, who was supposed to play centre on Toronto's the top line alongside Phil Kessel, is out with a bad shoulder and not expected to play in the Maple Leafs first two games, including the season-opener against Montreal.

Gagner, meanwhile, has been nursing a sprained ankle, so there's no guarantee he'd be ready any sooner than Connolly. In the longer term, however, GM Brian Burke might be looking for somebody like Gagner to bolster his top nine. Burke just added face-off specialist David Steckel, but he's a fourth-liner.

The Oilers have Ryan Nugent-Hopkins, Shawn Horcoff, Eric Belanger, Anton Lander and Gagner, when he's healthy, as centres. They also have Chris Vandevelde and Ryan O'Marra on the AHL farm.

While there are questions about Edmonton's blue line depth, especially with Ryan Whitney coming off ankle surgery and Ladislav Smid out with a separated shoulder, the Maple Leafs are heavy on the back end.

They have Dion Phaneuf, Carl Gunnarsson, John-Michael Liles, Luke Schenn, Mike Komisarek and rookie Jake Gardiner in their top six, with Cody Franson, Keith Aulie and Matt Lashoff, just sent to the minors, waiting in the wings.

Even if the Maple Leafs are interested in Gagner, as Cox says, it doesn't mean a thing unless Edmonton GM Steve Tambellini sees somebody in that group as a useful part on his blue line.

Listen to Robin Brownlee Wednesdays and Thursdays from 3 p.m. to 5 p.m. on the Jason Gregor Show on TEAM 1260.

Aceb4a1816f5fa09879a023b07d1a9b4
A sports writer since 1983, including stints at The Edmonton Journal and The Sun 1989-2007, I happily co-host the Jason Gregor Show on TSN 1260 twice a week and write when so inclined. Have the best damn lawn on the internet. Most important, I am Sam's dad. Follow me on Twitter at Robin_Brownlee. Or don't.
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#101 bazmagoo
October 06 2011, 05:50PM
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David S wrote:

Dude. You don't build a winning team by continually giving away your young, best players for dreams, magic beans and unicorns.

If, IF we were to trade Gagner, it better damn well be for a D-man of equal ability. Prospects and picks aren't even in that conversation.

It's like you'd be OK to trade Gagner for a high draft pick and Colten freaking Teubert (*spits*).

You must REALLY love losing.

Agreed

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#102 james_dean
October 06 2011, 06:29PM
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Gagner hemsky and 2nd round for pk subban and plekanek

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#103 Max Powers - Team HME Evans
October 06 2011, 06:36PM
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@ DS: You seem to have me confused with QB or something. Never did I recommend nor advocate trading our young players for picks or beans or even unicorns. I simply inquired about the worth of a player in a certain scenario and expressed what I thought his value was or could be. That's it. Nothing more nothing less. A simple question to a person whom I felt could give me a real answer. Like I stated before, I asked because I don't know. There has been a lot more outlandish trade scenarios in this comment section than mine. It's like I love losing? Come on, give your head a shake. Hypothetical scenario man.

And for the record, if I were GM and another GM offered up a real live Unicorn for Samwise... I would take it.

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#104 Peterborough
October 06 2011, 06:46PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

He was on pace for close to 50 BEFORE being sliced open by a skate blade. Moving up to the mid 50's or even the high 50's is NOT as big of a jump as you present it.

And if Gagner at 21 could produce points at the pace of someone who has been playing Pro for 14 years, dont you think that just maybe giving up on him at 22 is a tad pre-mature?

Obviously if the price is right anybody is available, but how long are Horcoff and Belanger going to be able to be 2C's? I look at RNH, Gagner, and Lander and I see the team's future #1,2,3 all set up but with almost nobody coming behind them. I see the wing, on the other hand, and I see kids waiting down on the farm to snatch time away from anyone who faulters.

Combine that with the near certainty that Hemsky has to be moved regardless of what the Oilers do with Sam Gagner and I dont see a need to rush the movement of Samwise.

"I look at RNH, Gagner, and Lander and I see the team's future #1,2,3 all set up but with almost nobody coming behind them"

Ryan Martindale Tyler Pitlick Travis Ewanyk

Those guys all have a shot, at least one year away each guy and probably three; However to say there is almost no one behind them is huge mistake.

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#105 Oilcruzer
October 06 2011, 06:47PM
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(if you ever need action on the bbs, just use Gagner and Trade in the same post.)

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#106 The Beaker
October 06 2011, 06:56PM
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Max Powers - Team HME Evans wrote:

@ DS: You seem to have me confused with QB or something. Never did I recommend nor advocate trading our young players for picks or beans or even unicorns. I simply inquired about the worth of a player in a certain scenario and expressed what I thought his value was or could be. That's it. Nothing more nothing less. A simple question to a person whom I felt could give me a real answer. Like I stated before, I asked because I don't know. There has been a lot more outlandish trade scenarios in this comment section than mine. It's like I love losing? Come on, give your head a shake. Hypothetical scenario man.

And for the record, if I were GM and another GM offered up a real live Unicorn for Samwise... I would take it.

The nucks would think twice about headshots.

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#107 Max Powers - Team HME Evans
October 06 2011, 07:12PM
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@The Beaker

That's ONLY if the Unicorn makes the team out of camp. I hear they take a few more years seasoning, like D-men.

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#108 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 06 2011, 07:16PM
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longbottom/P.Biglow wrote:

You might want to check them yourself. I checked the ten top centers 7(H.Sedin, J Thorton, P Datsyuk, C Perry, V Lecavlier, B Richards, M.Richards) the 5 year rule held true and 3(Crosby, Malkin, Stall) came in right away and scored 75+ points a year with in the five years. so thats 70% of the top ten centers in the league. Gagner isn't a top ranked center yet but he has also played 4 years. And of the 7centers named above Gagner ranked between Thorton at 44.8PPS and H Sedin at 34PPS Gagner at 43.2PPS.

What the?

Those are the top 10 centers?

If we want to pick 75 points as the magical number for a "breakout" the actual top 10 centers broke 75 points in year:

Sedin 5

Stamkos 2

B Richards 4(74 points in year 3)

Stall 2

Toews 4 (69 points in year 2)

Getzlaf 3

Kesler 6

Kopitar 2

Ribero 8 (but it was only his 3rd full season

Thorton 5 (but he had 71 in 72 games his 3rd year)

Not only did some of the guys you listed score 75+ before their 5 year, some of them aren't even centers.

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#109 longbottom/P.Biglow
October 06 2011, 07:33PM
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@OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F

You missed my whole point Year five is generally when centers get it. Year five and there after they consistiently break it as for the first four years I averaged them out to make a point Gagner isn't that far off, You also noticed that I said that the top four on the list did it consistenly. Every player I posted was listed as a Center by the Team so If you want to argue that point go tell the Teams, their roster listing is wrong according to you. I didn't Include Some of those centers listed as they are not generally considered to be in the top ten, Toews would be the closet but is he a better center than any I have listed? IMO no.But other wise TY for proveing my point that first line centers don't magically put up 75 points per season right off. Second line centers (which most agree Gagner falls into) is this season I bet.

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#110 oiler/hab
October 06 2011, 08:01PM
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You aren't suggesting pk & Plekanec for hopes & dreams, are you?????? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

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#111 Archaeologuy
October 06 2011, 08:12PM
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@Peterborough

Travis Ewanyk and Martindale are waiting in the wings. Beware real NHLers, these late rounders with huge question marks are comin for your spots.

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#112 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 06 2011, 08:31PM
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longbottom/P.Biglow wrote:

You missed my whole point Year five is generally when centers get it. Year five and there after they consistiently break it as for the first four years I averaged them out to make a point Gagner isn't that far off, You also noticed that I said that the top four on the list did it consistenly. Every player I posted was listed as a Center by the Team so If you want to argue that point go tell the Teams, their roster listing is wrong according to you. I didn't Include Some of those centers listed as they are not generally considered to be in the top ten, Toews would be the closet but is he a better center than any I have listed? IMO no.But other wise TY for proveing my point that first line centers don't magically put up 75 points per season right off. Second line centers (which most agree Gagner falls into) is this season I bet.

You don't really have a point because your whole premise is incorrect, top centers usually "get it" far before year 5. So I'm not really sure why you keep stating otherwise.

Even some of the guys you listed that supposedly "prove your point" put up 75+ before their 5th year. B Richards in year 4 and M Richards in year 3. So you don't even have your facts straight.

Also, considering theirs usually less then 10 centers per year that put up 75+ points, that's a ridiculously high mark to put up as your definition.

Finally, Perry is listed as a winger, which is what he is. So I have no idea where you are getting that he is a center from.

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#113 Saytalk
October 06 2011, 09:12PM
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The string of 40 point seasons aside, I look at Sam Gagner's game and I just don't see anything special there. He lacks the quickness, intensity and strength to be a top-tier player. Sure, we can keep the guy and he might eventually be a 50-60 point centre, but his total game is just plain mediocre. This is the type of player that gets a ton of ice-time on a non-playoff team. I'm not surprised Toronto is interested in him.

If you're going to compare him to anybody... try Walt Poddubny, Dan Quinn or Mike Bullard (but adjust for 80's scoring).

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#114 longbottom/P.Biglow
October 06 2011, 09:25PM
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My point is Gagner is going into year five. it as you have proven differnt centers differnt times to become the 1st-2nd line center on their teams. Last year Gagner upped his F/O% and was on his way to haveing a career year. Year five is when he takes that next step like Ribero, Sedin, Kesler,etc. But if you look at their first four years Gagner is ahead of them.

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#115 David S
October 06 2011, 09:43PM
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OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F wrote:

You don't really have a point because your whole premise is incorrect, top centers usually "get it" far before year 5. So I'm not really sure why you keep stating otherwise.

Even some of the guys you listed that supposedly "prove your point" put up 75+ before their 5th year. B Richards in year 4 and M Richards in year 3. So you don't even have your facts straight.

Also, considering theirs usually less then 10 centers per year that put up 75+ points, that's a ridiculously high mark to put up as your definition.

Finally, Perry is listed as a winger, which is what he is. So I have no idea where you are getting that he is a center from.

Sam's case is a bit more complicated. Those other guys you're thinking about were on teams in "win mode" and given support with actual NHL'ers as linemates.

I'm not going to say that Sam is a #1 forward because I think he still has to earn it. But he would have been far better off in a team system that wasn't so completely screwed up. Hell, on most decent teams he'd only be in his third year.

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#116 Jerk Store
October 06 2011, 10:42PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Travis Ewanyk and Martindale are waiting in the wings. Beware real NHLers, these late rounders with huge question marks are comin for your spots.

Arch, Beg to differ on your conclusion. While it is true these young guys have not proven anything in terms of being NHL ready, it can be argued their pedigree is better than two of the incumbent centers of which you speak. Martindale and Ewanyk were both 3rd rounders, 61st and 74th respectively. Belanger and Horcoff were both 4th rounders 96th and 99th overall. And the two younger fellows were drafted by the scouting mensch, Stu TBS MacGregor. While neither player is a lock by any stretch, my only point is they are arguably further up the food chain than 10 and 20, at the same point in their young careers. Ewanyk will never be a big time scorer in the NHL but he is an excellent face off guy, checker, agitator and will drop the mitts at the drop of a hat. In a few years if he continues to develop could be a valuable checking center. Ask the "Nuge" how much fun he was to play against during the WHL playoffs last year. 5 on 5 Nuge did not do much especially when the OKings had last change. Martindale is a bit of an enigma but is a big body with skill. Do not count him out either. Respectfully, JS.

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#117 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 06 2011, 10:51PM
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Jerk Store wrote:

Arch, Beg to differ on your conclusion. While it is true these young guys have not proven anything in terms of being NHL ready, it can be argued their pedigree is better than two of the incumbent centers of which you speak. Martindale and Ewanyk were both 3rd rounders, 61st and 74th respectively. Belanger and Horcoff were both 4th rounders 96th and 99th overall. And the two younger fellows were drafted by the scouting mensch, Stu TBS MacGregor. While neither player is a lock by any stretch, my only point is they are arguably further up the food chain than 10 and 20, at the same point in their young careers. Ewanyk will never be a big time scorer in the NHL but he is an excellent face off guy, checker, agitator and will drop the mitts at the drop of a hat. In a few years if he continues to develop could be a valuable checking center. Ask the "Nuge" how much fun he was to play against during the WHL playoffs last year. 5 on 5 Nuge did not do much especially when the OKings had last change. Martindale is a bit of an enigma but is a big body with skill. Do not count him out either. Respectfully, JS.

The odds of 3rd round picks developing into something more then a fringe NHL'er is honestly in the 10- 15 percent range.

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#118 TigerUnderGlass
October 06 2011, 10:57PM
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Jerk Store wrote:

Arch, Beg to differ on your conclusion. While it is true these young guys have not proven anything in terms of being NHL ready, it can be argued their pedigree is better than two of the incumbent centers of which you speak. Martindale and Ewanyk were both 3rd rounders, 61st and 74th respectively. Belanger and Horcoff were both 4th rounders 96th and 99th overall. And the two younger fellows were drafted by the scouting mensch, Stu TBS MacGregor. While neither player is a lock by any stretch, my only point is they are arguably further up the food chain than 10 and 20, at the same point in their young careers. Ewanyk will never be a big time scorer in the NHL but he is an excellent face off guy, checker, agitator and will drop the mitts at the drop of a hat. In a few years if he continues to develop could be a valuable checking center. Ask the "Nuge" how much fun he was to play against during the WHL playoffs last year. 5 on 5 Nuge did not do much especially when the OKings had last change. Martindale is a bit of an enigma but is a big body with skill. Do not count him out either. Respectfully, JS.

Ask the "Nuge" how much fun he was to play against during the WHL playoffs last year. 5 on 5 Nuge did not do much especially when the OKings had last change.

What are you talking about? In 4 playoff games against Edmonton Hopkins put up 9 points and 7 of them were even strength.

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#119 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 06 2011, 11:03PM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:
Ask the "Nuge" how much fun he was to play against during the WHL playoffs last year. 5 on 5 Nuge did not do much especially when the OKings had last change.

What are you talking about? In 4 playoff games against Edmonton Hopkins put up 9 points and 7 of them were even strength.

~What a shutdown performance by that Ewanyk. Belanger better look out, his job is in danger.~

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#120 Jerk Store
October 06 2011, 11:08PM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:
Ask the "Nuge" how much fun he was to play against during the WHL playoffs last year. 5 on 5 Nuge did not do much especially when the OKings had last change.

What are you talking about? In 4 playoff games against Edmonton Hopkins put up 9 points and 7 of them were even strength.

It was well documented and reported throughout the series that the Rebels did everything they could to keep NH away from Ewanyk and they succeeded with last change at home. They could not on the road. All I am saying was NH only managed one ES point when Ewanyk was on the ice. His performance in that series elevated his draft position. Period.

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#121 TigerUnderGlass
October 06 2011, 11:11PM
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Jerk Store wrote:

It was well documented and reported throughout the series that the Rebels did everything they could to keep NH away from Ewanyk and they succeeded with last change at home. They could not on the road. All I am saying was NH only managed one ES point when Ewanyk was on the ice. His performance in that series elevated his draft position. Period.

Interesting, because in the two games played in Edmonton he had 4 even strength points. He only had 3 EV points in Red Deer.

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#122 David S
October 06 2011, 11:17PM
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The conversation is over when guys like Martindale and Ewanyk are being mentioned in a comment thread under a post about Sam Gagner.

Jeez you guys. Martindale and Ewanyk? Really?

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#123 Jerk Store
October 06 2011, 11:18PM
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OB1 You are making my point. If the chances are 10 - 15 % for a 3rd rounder, what are they for a 4th rounder?, which Horcoff and Belanger both were. The point I am making is do not discount them out of hand because they are 3rd rounders. As I said initially (and I will slow down this time for your benefit) T-h-e-y a-r-e f-a-r f-r-o-m l-o-c-k-s. But obviously neither were Horc and Belanger when they were 18 and 19 years old and based solely on draft position could turn out better than either one. I only make this point as Arch indicated they were late round picks 9and really third round is not all that late.

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#124 Jerk Store
October 06 2011, 11:21PM
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I would continue to debate but David S says we can't. Sorry dudes.

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#125 David S
October 06 2011, 11:36PM
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Jerk Store wrote:

I would continue to debate but David S says we can't. Sorry dudes.

Hey man. Debate is fine but even fan debates go off the tracks when you start comparing 3rd round WHL draftees to, well, Sam Gagner. That's pulling the thread pretty tight, wouldn't you say? Next people will be talking about that 10 year old kid in Clareview house league who's really rippin' it up.

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#126 Jerk Store
October 06 2011, 11:47PM
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@David S

Fair enough, David S. I did not initiate the Ewanyk / Martindale thread and certainly did not intend to hijack the Gagner trade talk, which I agree is much more relevant - and could be even more pressing if Whitney continues to be out. To be clear, no one was comparing either to Gagner only saying it is too early to say an 18 or 19 year old has no shot to replace Horcoff or Belanger in 3 years.

I just hate misinformation. Speaking of which: Tig u Glass. N-H only had 2 ES points in Edmonton during playoffs. I will shut up now (on this topic anyway).

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#127 Peterborough
October 06 2011, 11:49PM
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David S wrote:

Hey man. Debate is fine but even fan debates go off the tracks when you start comparing 3rd round WHL draftees to, well, Sam Gagner. That's pulling the thread pretty tight, wouldn't you say? Next people will be talking about that 10 year old kid in Clareview house league who's really rippin' it up.

Kind of missing the point. Arch originally implied that we are not deep at centre prospects and I begged to differ. Mentioning Pitlick and the "3rdies"

cheers.

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#128 TigerUnderGlass
October 06 2011, 11:55PM
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Jerk Store wrote:

Fair enough, David S. I did not initiate the Ewanyk / Martindale thread and certainly did not intend to hijack the Gagner trade talk, which I agree is much more relevant - and could be even more pressing if Whitney continues to be out. To be clear, no one was comparing either to Gagner only saying it is too early to say an 18 or 19 year old has no shot to replace Horcoff or Belanger in 3 years.

I just hate misinformation. Speaking of which: Tig u Glass. N-H only had 2 ES points in Edmonton during playoffs. I will shut up now (on this topic anyway).

Whoops, you're right. I looked a bit too quickly.

The problem is that my point still stands even though I'm off by half... unless you consider *holding* him to a point per game at evens some sort of special accomplishment.

Most people don't consider that "nothing".

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#129 Douche Nietzsche
October 07 2011, 12:21AM
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@Robin Brownlee

Unless, I got a case of amnesia and don't know about, I don't recall writing anything in CAPS. I have only made 10 or so comments in total, and I am certain none were in CAPS or disrespectful.

If you, or who ever else might have these messages, could please find the time to forward them to my e-mail, I would like to see them. Maybe my account is hacked or one of my friends used my laptop while I was away. I apologize for what ever was said or if anyone was insulted but I can guarantee you it wasn't me.

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#130 knobby
October 07 2011, 03:05AM
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I think that this is Gagner's year to turn things up a notch or two. Prior to his most recent injury he appeared to be step quicker. He was putting the puck into the corner and going after it. Trading him now would likely be unwise. Maybe re-assess at the trade deadline. By that time the coaches will have a better idea if the young guns are bringing more to the team than him. Maybe the pressure would be more on the offering GM of a contending team to make a better deal for the Oil.

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#131 OilFan
October 07 2011, 07:13AM
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Do you guys really think Gagner is that good ? You do realize your comparing him with good players and using age as the only justification. Try using skill to compare them. Or just use age and forget about that fact the other players can skate, shoot and win draws a rate Gagner hasn't seen. This is why people claim Oiler fans over hype there prospects , rookies and players.

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#132 Archaeologuy
October 07 2011, 07:57AM
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Peterborough wrote:

Kind of missing the point. Arch originally implied that we are not deep at centre prospects and I begged to differ. Mentioning Pitlick and the "3rdies"

cheers.

And I still contend we are not deep at centre prospects. All the best ones are graduated to the NHL (at least for opening day).

What we have left is an AHL rookie who is coming off of a middling WHL season, a skilled player whose heart has been questioned and who has some unexplained contract questions, and a WHL 2nd liner needing shoulder surgery just months after being drafted.

You need to do some serious convincing to argue that the Oilers have more depth at C than what is currently on the NHL roster.

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#133 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 07 2011, 08:11AM
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Jerk Store wrote:

OB1 You are making my point. If the chances are 10 - 15 % for a 3rd rounder, what are they for a 4th rounder?, which Horcoff and Belanger both were. The point I am making is do not discount them out of hand because they are 3rd rounders. As I said initially (and I will slow down this time for your benefit) T-h-e-y a-r-e f-a-r f-r-o-m l-o-c-k-s. But obviously neither were Horc and Belanger when they were 18 and 19 years old and based solely on draft position could turn out better than either one. I only make this point as Arch indicated they were late round picks 9and really third round is not all that late.

Just off the top of my head 4th rounders have a 5% - 10% chance.... however just because we have two that beat the odds doesn't mean a couple 3rd rounders have a superior chance of making it.

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#134 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 07 2011, 08:13AM
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Peterborough wrote:

Kind of missing the point. Arch originally implied that we are not deep at centre prospects and I begged to differ. Mentioning Pitlick and the "3rdies"

cheers.

Well we aren't deep at center.

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#135 Archaeologuy
October 07 2011, 08:16AM
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@OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F

I won the lottery the other day. My next move was to use those lottery winnings to buy 50/50 tickets at Eskimo games because I had a better shot of winning. Because I won the lottery at lower odds it was assured that I would win multiple times at games with better odds.

That made perfect sense right?

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#136 Jerk Store
October 07 2011, 08:18AM
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@OilFan

It is not what Gagner is, it is what he COULD be. Certainly it is not likely (some would say impossible) he will ever become what the Sedins or a Datysuk currently are. However, the kid (and he still is a kid) has a great pedigree and has showed flashes of brilliance at times. And despite his shortcomings (poor on face offs, not great size, injuries) he has what is potentially the most dangerous quality (to a GM anyway) .... potential. Those of us old enough remember the Oilers releasing Ray Whitney or the Flames trading a Martin St. Louis, both at the "washed up" age of 25 years old. But there are also tons of highly rated juniors who had decent careers but never quite broke out as stars (Jeff Friesen, Pat Falloon, David Legwand, JP Dumont and countless others). Where Gagner (Gagne for you Flames fans, Canucks fans and trout) fits in ..... well that is the rub, isn't it?

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#137 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 07 2011, 08:27AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

I won the lottery the other day. My next move was to use those lottery winnings to buy 50/50 tickets at Eskimo games because I had a better shot of winning. Because I won the lottery at lower odds it was assured that I would win multiple times at games with better odds.

That made perfect sense right?

I've been told it does.

Also, I think people are confusing having centers in the system with beeing deep at center. If people think we are deep at center through the orginization I'd say it's safe to say those people should think that close to every team in the league is deep at center.

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#138 Archaeologuy
October 07 2011, 08:49AM
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@OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F

It's crazy. The second a new name is added into the mix people are treating it like that new player has accomplished something. Travis Freaking Ewanyk?!

If the Oilers trade Sam Gagner today they will have nobody after RNH and Lander with a snowballs chance in hell of being an NHL center within 2 years.

That is not an organization deep at C.

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#139 mayorpoop
October 07 2011, 09:08AM
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@Archaeologuy

i'm not advocating trading gagner, necessarily. what do you suggest we do to fill the holes in defence? are those prospects we have enough? what would you examine as possible to make the team better other than never trading anyone that is young for fear of potential going with.

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#140 Archaeologuy
October 07 2011, 09:32AM
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@mayorpoop

No the prospects we have at D are not enough. Not even close.

1) The Oilers are in a bind with Hemsky. The season is about to start, he's a UFA on July 1st, and there hasnt been a word said about them negotiating a contract. It seems like a better than 75% chance that he's going to be traded before the deadline. There's 1 route to get a Dman.

2) The Oilers have much more depth on the wing than they do at any other position. Omark and Paajarvi are playing on the 3rd line right now. I would imagine that one of them could fetch a defenseman. Paajarvi nets a higher end one than Omark but Omark is older and easier for the Oilers to part with emotionally. There is still Hartikainen waiting in OKC and Petrell is warming a seat for Eager before he goes back to Oklahoma too.

Honestly, I think the best bet is a package of Hemsky and prospects for an established defenseman.*

*I am a big Hemsky fan, just reading the tea-leaves with his contract and the need to move guys before they become UFAs

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#141 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 07 2011, 09:46AM
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mayorpoop wrote:

i'm not advocating trading gagner, necessarily. what do you suggest we do to fill the holes in defence? are those prospects we have enough? what would you examine as possible to make the team better other than never trading anyone that is young for fear of potential going with.

Trade picks/prospects + sign free agents.

If a big fish hits the market (Weber/Suter/Burns from this past summer) then proven NHL'ers come into play

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#142 Chris.
October 07 2011, 10:04AM
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Gagner is too good a player to move for any of the D Toronto has available.

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#143 Quicksilver ballet
October 07 2011, 10:15AM
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Romanus wrote:

Good idea. We can keep replacing veterans for prospects forever and keep the rebuild going for 20 more years.

We have done it your way the last 20 yrs, haven't you had enough of this bullship already? Has there ever been a darker period in Oiler history than the last 20? Yeah, good luck with that then.

The problem is, we keep hanging onto these support players (10 83 89) who've been cast as leaders here. Frack them all, get'em outta here, watch the few first and second yr NHL'ers make them all expendable. It's already a bloody farce that these guys are actually showing these new kids how it's done.

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#144 mayorpoop
October 07 2011, 10:16AM
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@Archaeologuy

i agree hemsky and his contract are concerning. without question. he very well may be the likely and most valued asset we have and in turn trade bait.

omark - he's your goat so....

on the wing we do have excess but most of that excess is of the young variety as well. so i'm not sure why they (MPS, Omark, Harti) are reasonable options to move compared to others.

smyth's best 2nd line days are near over so i would like to see omark and MPS get a good showing in a more offensive role, the top 6.

one way or the other, whether it be center or winger in order to get something you have give away something. sitting on our hands in fear of making trades is only going to help us stay where we are.

gagner or not something has to give.

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#145 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 07 2011, 10:18AM
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Quicksilver ballet wrote:

We have done it your way the last 20 yrs, haven't you had enough of this bullship already? Has there ever been a darker period in Oiler history than the last 20? Yeah, good luck with that then.

The problem is, we keep hanging onto these support players (10 83 89) who've been cast as leaders here. Frack them all, get'em outta here, watch the few first and second yr NHL'ers make them all expendable. It's already a bloody farce that these guys are actually showing these new kids how it's done.

??

What we've been doing the last 20 years is actually what YOU are suggesting.

Shipping vetrans out for picks + prospects.

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#146 mayorpoop
October 07 2011, 10:18AM
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Chris. wrote:

Gagner is too good a player to move for any of the D Toronto has available.

correct except for schenn. there is no way burke would trade him tho so yes i a way you are 100% right.

we do not need more prospects in a position were we have nothinig but prospects.

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#147 Archaeologuy
October 07 2011, 10:19AM
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@mayorpoop

Omark is my goat, but that doesnt mean that its wrong to package him up for a defender.

And dont you talk sass about Smyth!!

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#148 Quicksilver ballet
October 07 2011, 10:36AM
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OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F wrote:

??

What we've been doing the last 20 years is actually what YOU are suggesting.

Shipping vetrans out for picks + prospects.

We can go on and on about shoulda coulda. The truth is the Oilers haven't had any real leadership here since Chris Pronger left. They may have one or two in the fold now with 4 and 93.

It's time to remove those pre-2009 cardboard cutouts in the window display that are currently being passed off as leaders. Timing is everything with these kids being able to walk when they're only 25.

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#149 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
October 07 2011, 10:53AM
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@ QSB we have no idea which guys are leaders and which aren't. Also, teams aren't made up of 20 "leaders".

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#150 Peterborough
October 07 2011, 10:59AM
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OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F wrote:

Well we aren't deep at center.

We have in my opinion 5 guys on the big club that can play in the NHL. RNH is got 1C Gags 2C Horc 3C Belanger 4C that is set for years. Lander is knocking on the door and the youngersters mentioned will be looking at the 2-3 C positions soon plus we have guys like Chris Vande Velde, Milan Kytnar and Ryan O'Marra that may well turn into uselful 4Cs.

Is that not depth? I'm not saying trade any of them untill the logjam completes and guys push others out. But it looks very bright at C for the Oil.

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