Vande Velde Van Gogh In the FO Circle

Lowetide
April 03 2011 07:30AM

Chris Vande Velde arrived in pro hockey with a reputation for being a quality performer in the faceoff circle. He's performed well in the discipline in college, the American League and now in a small NHL sample. How valuable is the skill? Will it secure the Dutchman NHL employment?

When he was a junior and then college player, Vande Velde was a go-to guy in the faceoff circle and played the center position with aplomb. His draft day scouting report implied quality, and the earliest glimpse of the type of player we've seen recently in Edmonton:

  • Redline report: He has an incredibly long reach and is uncanny playing in traffic. When he got his skating legs going, he was nearly impossible to push off the puck, in an almost Keith Primeau–like fashion. Like Oshie, North Dakota has VandeVelde slated for the fall of 2006, and until then, he'll skate for the Lincoln Stars.

When Vande Velde turned pro last fall, I felt he'd be the first of the new pro's to emerge (based on age). However, Vande Velde's numbers (62gp, 12-4-16 -17) are not good and the number of minor leaguers recalled ahead of him (Reddox, Omark, O'Marra) suggested there was much to learn.

Doritogrande will be a well known name to Oilogosphere readers and he offered some exceptional insight into Vande Velde in OKC here. Quoting a portion of the post:

  • Chris VandeVelde was pegged as the de-facto checking center tonight, and was given the linemates befitting a player that the coaching staff wants in a defined role. He was able to saw-off the Moose top line of Hodgson-Volpatti-Shirokov with a little help from his friends. He showed good hustle, average speed and good skills in the faceoff dot.

This fits with Todd Nelson's (OKC's coach) viewpoint on the player:

  • His adjustment was learning the pro game. Up until Christmas, he was okay for us. But after Christmas he took it upon himself to play well in his D zone. Along with that, with the more responsibility he got, he began to improve offensively. He's been good for us, he's been excellent in the faceoff circle. He's 1-2 every night, it's either him or O'Marra.  

The entire interview is here. Vande Velde's rookie AHL season has him tied for 105th among rookies in that league, so he's going to have to bring other elements to his game. And that's where we can talk about his size (6.02, 204) and his ability in the faceoff circle.

In a very small sample size (8 games), Vande Velde is 56.7% on the dot (in 97 sorties). He's also gaining the confidence of the coach.

  • Tom Renney: “He’s very reliable. To a point, you expect what he delivers and he does. He’s a little bit predictable in that way, which is a good thing. I’m just tying to give him an opportunity to play in a number of different circumstances and he’s done well.”

The Renney quote (along with more on Vande Velde) is here.

WHAT DOES IT ALL MEAN?

Vande Velde is building enough of a resume to be "in the mix" for NHL employment in 11-12. A good bet would be more AHL time but perhaps an earlier recall when injuries or slumps force roster moves. I'd estimate he fits this way into the center depth chart at the pro level:

  1. Shawn Horcoff
  2. Sam Gagner
  3. Andrew Cogliano
  4. Colin Fraser
  5. Chris Vande Velde
  6. Ryan O'Marra
  7. Anton Lander (unsigned)
  8. Milan Kytnar

There are all kinds of things that could change (drafting RNH, moving Hall to center) but as it stands that 4line job should be an interesting contest during TC in the fall. Vande Velde's spring audition puts him in the mix, and his faceoff ability--in a small sample size--may make him a favorite.

C2a6955161684b5e3189319acfa5ebe4
Lowetide has been one of the Oilogosphere's shining lights for over a century. You can check him out here at OilersNation and at lowetide.ca. He is also the host of Lowdown with Lowetide weekday mornings 10-noon on Team 1260.
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#51 Smokey
April 04 2011, 12:00PM
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Peter-b, keep preachin the truth brudda.

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#52 ricky p
April 04 2011, 12:28PM
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Peterborough wrote:

No one had Perry becoming what he became with his kating comming out of Junior. Do you feel the same way about the Pronger trade with ST. Louis???

You tweak with trades you don't build with them. And you lose again next year and get another stud. Thats how you build a winner.

It not about next year. This isn't the NFL its about the year after and going forward from there.

If your too old and can't wait that long hurry up and die.

. . .

no one loves you anyways

Are you stupid? So no one knows Perry's upside, yet you think all the Oiler drafts are gold. Lose for another stud, give me a break. It's stupid people like you that got this draft thing as our future. Your future buddy is to pull your head out of your a$$.

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#53 Quicksilver ballet
April 04 2011, 12:51PM
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Peterborough wrote:

No one had Perry becoming what he became with his kating comming out of Junior. Do you feel the same way about the Pronger trade with ST. Louis???

You tweak with trades you don't build with them. And you lose again next year and get another stud. Thats how you build a winner.

It not about next year. This isn't the NFL its about the year after and going forward from there.

If your too old and can't wait that long hurry up and die.

. . .

no one loves you anyways

.....orders a Cola and popcorn.

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#54 Peterborough
April 04 2011, 12:59PM
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ricky p wrote:

Are you stupid? So no one knows Perry's upside, yet you think all the Oiler drafts are gold. Lose for another stud, give me a break. It's stupid people like you that got this draft thing as our future. Your future buddy is to pull your head out of your a$$.

. . . So not wanting to abandon the "plan", that virtually everyone agreed was the best choice of action after one year; after its done exactly what it's supposed to do: That makes you stupid?

Do me a favour go to this site:

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/

Take a good look at our kids. Then take a look a the guys who are new to it since this whole "Oil Change" started. Now take a look at the other 30 teams and what they have. Add to that no team has a better group of picks than we do in the draft.

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#55 dawgbone
April 04 2011, 01:31PM
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Peterborough wrote:

. . . So not wanting to abandon the "plan", that virtually everyone agreed was the best choice of action after one year; after its done exactly what it's supposed to do: That makes you stupid?

Do me a favour go to this site:

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/

Take a good look at our kids. Then take a look a the guys who are new to it since this whole "Oil Change" started. Now take a look at the other 30 teams and what they have. Add to that no team has a better group of picks than we do in the draft.

All kids look good until they are 5 years older. Hell, Sam Gagner is already trade bait because half the fans think he's no good, and he's what, 21?

The problem with the build through the draft philosophy is that for Every Chicago there is an Atlanta. For every Pittsburgh there is a Florida.

The problem with building through the draft is that you are picking an 18 year old to play in a league dominated by 27 year olds. The best 18 year old isn't always the best player 7 or 8 years down the road.

Part of "the plan" should include adding players to make the team better in the short term. There's enough decent NHL players floating around every summer that you should be able to go from a lottery team to playoff team in a season or two.

Providing the Oilers only look at the draft option, they are going to miss out big time.

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#56 Peterborough
April 04 2011, 02:58PM
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No one is saying that. Its the lets trade picks and prospects talk thats crazy. We're not there yet. A couple of UFA on two contacts would be lovely. Scotty Upstall to play with Hemsky would make me crazy happy. But we are at a add value or trade at max value point in the process. Who can we get max value for??? With the the injuries have gone this year the answer is no one right now. So make a trade a make us weaker??? No one short of Bob Flanagan: Super Masochist is going to like sucking next year . . . However the alternative is to become the next Toronto, is that what you want?

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#57 TigerUnderGlass
April 04 2011, 03:37PM
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Peterborough wrote:

Are you really comapring the programs they have in Atlata and Florida to those in Pitt and Chitown??? Thats just plain irresponsible and surface skimming. Why has Atanta failed repeatedly??? Trading away prospect like Coburn for vets like Zhitnik in a "win now mentality"

Show me were Chicago or Pitt did that or traded away they're top picks like Florida did. To build by the draft right you need a good system to develope the kids we have that now. Those successful draft builders did too. The failures did not. Get where this is going?

Chicago had 9 players over 30 play at least 25 games during Kane and Toews rookie season.

During their, what you would have us believe was a completely draft based rebuild they signed players like Campbell and Huet because of their "win now attitiude." Not to mention other promising youth such as Handzus, Perrault and Lang. They traded for Pahlsson around that time as well.

The year before Kane they carried more youth on their roster like Bondra, Smolinski, Cullimore, Aucoin and Lapointe. This ignores a few other vets too, but you get the idea.

The point is that they didn't sit on their hands waiting and praying that their draft picks were going to all pan out. Don't pretend they did.

This so called "strategy" is nothing but an excuse for losing so they can all keep their jobs for another 4-6 years without doing anything to earn their keep.

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#58 OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F
April 04 2011, 03:57PM
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Wäx Män Riley wrote:

I agree that they need some capable veterans. It is hard to find those players though, through free agency especially. Those young promising players won't sign with the 2nd least desirable team in the league to player for.

Trades are arguably a better way to do it, but how has that worked for the Flames or Leafs?

There does seem to be a plan in place and it started with establishing an AHL team and stockpiling draft picks.

Yet over each of the last 2 summers capable vets have sat at home waiting for a contract well into the summer.

I love how you list the Flames and the Leafs. What about all the playoff teams that have made trades?

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#59 TigerUnderGlass
April 04 2011, 04:21PM
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@Wäx Män Riley

I agree that they need some capable veterans. It is hard to find those players though through free agency especially. Those young promising players won't sign with the 2nd least desirable team in the league to player for.

I'm not sure how to respond here because it's a bit disjointed. Are we talking about veterans or young players?

There does seem to be a plan in place and it started with establishing an AHL team and stockpiling draft picks.

So finally doing what other teams do and getting a farm team and then planning to lose as much as possible to get high picks and then hope they all work out counts as a plan to you?

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#60 Wäx Män Riley
April 04 2011, 04:50PM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:
I agree that they need some capable veterans. It is hard to find those players though through free agency especially. Those young promising players won't sign with the 2nd least desirable team in the league to player for.

I'm not sure how to respond here because it's a bit disjointed. Are we talking about veterans or young players?

There does seem to be a plan in place and it started with establishing an AHL team and stockpiling draft picks.

So finally doing what other teams do and getting a farm team and then planning to lose as much as possible to get high picks and then hope they all work out counts as a plan to you?

I meant that finding those promising free agents is tough because of...

I'm not going to defend the idiots that decided they didn't need their own farm team. That is a choice that I could never understand. They had to get an AHL team, and they want to stock picks in order to make that farm team an actual farm team.

You state it quite dirty, but you know what? That's kind of the plan.

Here is how I would state it:

1. "Not having an AHL team has damaged this organization. We need to establish a farm team in order to be able to use it as a development step for our players. We need more picks so we can produce a competitive atmosphere where players must fight for their ice time. We have a few prospects coming up, but to help this team long-term, lets stock up on prospects. It will be a tough few years as our existing prospects develop, but that will help in our goal of getting more prospects."

"As those prospects learn and grow, we will look to possibly trading some of our picks/prospects that we have been building up, or try to sign the bigger free agents to ice a competitive team. As that team competes, we will have the farm team stocked up already so if/when the injuries come, we will have capable players to fill in as well as an avenue for our picks that weren't first overall."

Arguably a different way of saying:

2."Uhhh... lets plan to lose as much as possible to get high picks that we hope will work out."

The first option sounds like a plan, and I'll bet is closer to what is happening than the second option.

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#61 Peterborough
April 04 2011, 05:25PM
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Steve Smith wrote:

Tampa's doing it this year. Toronto has an outside chance of doing it in one year, just as Colorado and L.A. did last year.

(Though you could always disqualify the Leafs on the basis that they didn't actually have a lottery pick.)

Tampa is an interesting example. They had two top two picks in a row improved signifgently the next season, then made it. Big difference is the support. Tampa has the core vets that we don't St. Louis and Vinny are miles ahead of Horcoff and Hemsky. We simply have more needs and have no, repeat: no realistic chance of aquiring the 1D or 1C we need other than developing them ourselves.

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#62 David S
April 05 2011, 12:01AM
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Steve Smith wrote:

That's not compatible with trying to sign Malhotra, or with signing Khabibulin, who was acquired on the mistaken belief that he was good. This is ineptitude.

I mean, he obviously wasn't trying to contend for the Cup this year, but I don't think there's much doubt he was trying to improve: that's why he attempted, however unsuccessfully, to get a bottom six centre and attempted, however unsuccessfully, to get a top-four defenseman.

@Steve - C'mon. You were around back in the 'sphere so you know Khabibulin was signed to entice Heatley, back when he (Khabby) still had some street cred.

And the Oilers made a pretty big "show" of the Malholtra attempt (on Oil Change - an Oilers production wouldn't you know), despite the fact those kinds of things are state guarded secrets by this team. Funny how that just happened to slip by the PR department censor crew huh? It was a rather obvious plant to prove "we're trying" - a nice PR diversion tactic.

We tanked it this year. Everybody knows it by now. There's way too much evidence for it to even be questionable. In fact, if you assume we we going for 30th and the #1 draft, almost every bizarre move that was/wasn't made makes sense.

Pro sport is just as much (or more) theater as it is reality. This season we got Macbeth.

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#63 Peterborough
April 05 2011, 01:33AM
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OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F wrote:

Kubina signed with TB (24th last year)

Corvo signed with the Canes (23rd last year)

Randy Jones with TB (24th)

Klesla signed with CBJ (27th)

Robidas signed with Stars (20th)

Jurcina signed with the NYI (26th)

Jurcina is poop in human form. Randy Jones is the only signing the rest are re-ups.

Do some fact finding . . . or do you enjoy publicly humiliating yourself and making us a little dumber as a group?

Also I think anyone could see TB was clearly on the cusp last year. Data context will help you if you let it.

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#64 Peterborough
April 05 2011, 01:37AM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:

Cutting edge? Perhaps you could elaborate, because I am excited to hear all about the Oilers new cutting edge development program.

the Hockey News future watch has nice article on it. You should read it yourself like a big boy!

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#65 Peterborough
April 05 2011, 01:39AM
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OB1 Team Yakopov - F.S.T.N.F wrote:

This is a great example of setting the bar set low for years.

Going with no AHL team for years suddenly means we are "cutting edge" because we have an AHL team?

I can't claim to know alot about our various levels of player development, but I'd bet heavy they aren't much different then 60% - 70% of the rest of the teams in the league.

Sorry, but having an AHL team doesn't scream "legacy of sustained excellence... like Detroit" to me.

refer to last guy. . . .mutts and lots of 'em!

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#66 TigerUnderGlass
April 05 2011, 12:13PM
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Peterborough wrote:

the Hockey News future watch has nice article on it. You should read it yourself like a big boy!

Do you work for THN or is this your way of avoiding the question?

also...why do you keep giving yourself props?

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#67 OilBomber
April 03 2011, 08:01AM
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Great article as always, LT.

It seems that Fraser is a player that has a skill set that can be replaced over the summer - particularly considering his underwhelming performance this year. His inability to have a consistent, positive presence in the faceoff circle is a damning statistic. Any chance he finds another home for next season?

What do you think the chances are that the Oil fast track VV to the show next year to replace Fraser? Watching him play the last couple of games makes me think that he may be playing a little out of his depth, but he's not too far off. What he offers is exactly what this team needs - a big body with physical presence and (seemingly) a clue in the faceoff circle.

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#69 Oilcruzer
April 03 2011, 09:26AM
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"When he gets his legs going" is a big when. The Primeau analogy is pretty good, I compare his skating to a diesel powered engine. Sort of Mike Grierish.

Assuming Oil chose Larsson, I figure LT's list is close but maybe...

Shawn Horcoff

Sam Gagner

Andrew Cogliano

Chris Vande Velde

Colin Fraser

Anton Lander (unsigned)

Milan Kytnar

Ryan O'Marra

(O'Marra has shown zero NHL-ready talent, the JFJ of centres)

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#70 Smokey
April 03 2011, 09:32AM
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Oilers Centers next season are Horcoff, Gagne, RNH, and Lander, and VDV. Some of you got to look beyond Cogliano.

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Oilcruzer wrote:

"When he gets his legs going" is a big when. The Primeau analogy is pretty good, I compare his skating to a diesel powered engine. Sort of Mike Grierish.

Assuming Oil chose Larsson, I figure LT's list is close but maybe...

Shawn Horcoff

Sam Gagner

Andrew Cogliano

Chris Vande Velde

Colin Fraser

Anton Lander (unsigned)

Milan Kytnar

Ryan O'Marra

(O'Marra has shown zero NHL-ready talent, the JFJ of centres)

Yes!

No reason for neither O'Marra nor Fraser to take up even a second of others' ice time. #bothuseless

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#72 misfit
April 03 2011, 10:16AM
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I think he'll be a lot like Washington's David Steckel, not only in the type of player he projects to be, but the fact that he'll likely spend 2-3 years in the minors before making the jump to the NHL.

I'd like to see him get at least one more year shutting down the best in the AHL before expecting him to do the same in the NHL.

More than anything, I just want to see the Oilers actually adress the tough minutes/PK/shutdown center with a player who's actually proven they can do it at the NHL level rather than just crossing their fingers and hoping Fraser/Brodziak/Cogliano/Pouliot are going to be able to handle the role.

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Steve Smith wrote:

Reserving NHL spots for two centres who have never played a professional hockey game in North America, neither of whom is under contract to the Oilers, and one of whom isn't even Oilers' property, is a truly excellent idea.

~OMG, look at, he misspelled Gagner too!~

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#75 Team Hall
April 03 2011, 10:34AM
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What a game LT! I was clamouring for signing an NHL vet to help in the FO circle, but maybe we have found our man internally. Personally, I would be for moving Fraser and/or Cogs to the wing and let VV win some faceoffs. What a difference a few faceoff wins makes. When you start with the puck you get more chances, more chances means more confidence. Nextyeartown: Hall RNH Eberle MP Gags Omark Jones Horc Cogs Hartik VV Reddox Mac Fraser Omarra

Time to trade Hemmer?

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#76 Mike Modano's Dog
April 03 2011, 11:00AM
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I was watching O'Marra last night and noticed something that I wanted to mention. He had a couple chances to really lay out a big hit, any hit, on the play, and begged off of it.

For a guy who has a future in the N.H.L. not yet secured I would think he would take every opportunity given to him to make the play. He doesn't necessarily shine in any one area, but he has the size that any team would like to add to their roster. If he became a devestating hitter I believe he would make the N.H.L. and stay there for good. You need to be really good at something and shine in one area to get noticed unless you're really good in every area.

I hope he starts the hitting for us very soon because our team, and his career could use that quality.

I'm not here to trash him as a player, because I wish him the best for his career, and for the Oilers. I'm curious if any others have noticed the same. Did I just see a few missed opportunities and make an overgeneralization about his play? Does he usually finish his checks - or is this something he needs to improve?

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#77 magisterrex
April 03 2011, 11:12AM
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Did I just see a few missed opportunities and make an overgeneralization about his play? Does he usually finish his checks - or is this something he needs to improve?

Or worse yet, I didn't even notice him on the ice...

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#78 dougtheslug
April 03 2011, 11:29AM
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With all due respect, a team with Cogs 3 or 4 on the depth chart is a team gunning for a lottery pick, not a playoff spot. He seems to have really stalled in his development here and even with second line and power play time his production is woeful. The Oilers have twice tried to trade him so I think they know the score. But his value certainly has dropped because of his past two years. Omark needs a legitimate sniper to dish to - Maybe RNH?

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#79 Biowolf
April 03 2011, 11:31AM
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The Oilers are playing better now than they played all season. Does that tell you something about the guys you are ranking above VV.

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#80 The Real Scuba Steve
April 03 2011, 11:34AM
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@ Lowetide

Do think the Oilers might bid on some URFAs this summer? Filling the holes we need through the draft doesn't seem to be working.

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#81 a lg dubl dubl
April 03 2011, 11:50AM
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Dave wrote:

Always look forward to your Sunday morning pieces LT.

I don't know if there will be room for Vandevelde next year. Here's how I see the middle in 11-12:

Horcoff Gagner Lander Cogliano

On a side note, Hartikainen is here to stay. He's going to be a fan favorite for years.

Im just curious mr Dave why would you put a dude like Lander whos hasnt played a lick in north america over VV? IMO if Lander does sign id put him in the minors to start the year then if injuries come up(and lord knows they will) id look at bringing him up for sure.

Heres how I see the line up down the middle next yr:

Gagner,Horcoff,Cogs,VV

if the MIGHTY OIL draft the Nuge and RNH makes the team then i see the line up down the middle like this:

Gagner,Horcoff,VV,RNH(Cogs to the wing)

but thats just my opinion that is all

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#82 positivebrontefan
April 03 2011, 12:02PM
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The Real Scuba Steve wrote:

@ Lowetide

Do think the Oilers might bid on some URFAs this summer? Filling the holes we need through the draft doesn't seem to be working.

I disagree, it is working but the draft route takes time. All I know is we better get a number one center soon because if we don't we will have to get a URFA to fill the void.

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#83 @NateInVegas
April 03 2011, 12:30PM
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Yanic Perreault

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#84 Senator Theo
April 03 2011, 12:42PM
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In my opinion, RNH will be playing back in Red Deer next year - regardless of who drafts him.

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#85 Quicksilver ballet
April 03 2011, 12:47PM
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What a dogs breakfast that depth chart at center is. If the Oilers grab Hopkins, combined with the usual rash of injuries Vandy may find himself centering our 1st line for a good portion of next season.

Are there any early favorites for the 2012 entry draft yet, with no Taylor Halls we must all bored by this years crop of eligibles by now.

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#86 misfit
April 03 2011, 01:10PM
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@rds

That shift has already taken place from what I can tell. The only reason Cogliano has spent any time in the top 6 is because of injuries.

And he's greatly improved on the PK from what I can tell. I've been really impressed with his development in that area most of the year.

The faceoff thing is an issue, but if a center can do all the other things well, not being a dynamo on the FO dot isn't such a big deal.

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#87 Wäx Män Riley
April 03 2011, 01:19PM
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Senator Theo wrote:

In my opinion, RNH will be playing back in Red Deer next year - regardless of who drafts him.

I think so too. If he can be in junior for another year, I would keep him there to dominate. No need to rush him up here a la Cogs or Gagner. He will get his chance.

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#88 Dave
April 03 2011, 01:19PM
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a lg dubl dubl wrote:

Im just curious mr Dave why would you put a dude like Lander whos hasnt played a lick in north america over VV? IMO if Lander does sign id put him in the minors to start the year then if injuries come up(and lord knows they will) id look at bringing him up for sure.

Heres how I see the line up down the middle next yr:

Gagner,Horcoff,Cogs,VV

if the MIGHTY OIL draft the Nuge and RNH makes the team then i see the line up down the middle like this:

Gagner,Horcoff,VV,RNH(Cogs to the wing)

but thats just my opinion that is all

I think Lander's game affords him an opportunity because it fills that gritty, tenacious, face-off winning centre hole the oilers have been trying to fill.

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#89 Wäx Män Riley
April 03 2011, 01:21PM
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I do believe the Oil will draft Larson though. I'm not a fan of drafting a D with the first overall, but I just have that feeling....

I would like to see RNH drafted and kept in junior, then a couple of D with the later picks.

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#90 Woodguy
April 03 2011, 01:29PM
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misfit wrote:

I think he'll be a lot like Washington's David Steckel, not only in the type of player he projects to be, but the fact that he'll likely spend 2-3 years in the minors before making the jump to the NHL.

I'd like to see him get at least one more year shutting down the best in the AHL before expecting him to do the same in the NHL.

More than anything, I just want to see the Oilers actually adress the tough minutes/PK/shutdown center with a player who's actually proven they can do it at the NHL level rather than just crossing their fingers and hoping Fraser/Brodziak/Cogliano/Pouliot are going to be able to handle the role.

In Edmonton the act of giving players a role well above their established NHL level and hoping for the best is known as "Managing"

Lowe did it often and Tambellini is turning it into an art.

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#91 Oilfan14
April 03 2011, 01:43PM
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Can you imagine if the Oil draft RNH, send him back to junior and he has the chance to dominate at the world junior tournament in Edmonton!! The best part is that Calgary will get the chance to see him in person as well. Sweetness!!!

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#92 TheseColoursDon'tRun
April 03 2011, 01:53PM
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I thought Lander decided he wasn't going to come over next year and didn't want to sign with the oilers just yet when Tambellini was in Sweden a couple weeks ago checking out Larsson. Did anybody else read that or have I been smoking the carpet?

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#93 TigerUnderGlass
April 03 2011, 02:21PM
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Wäx Män Riley wrote:

I think so too. If he can be in junior for another year, I would keep him there to dominate. No need to rush him up here a la Cogs or Gagner. He will get his chance.

What is everyone's obsession with "we rushed Gagner and Cogliano?"

Nobody has any idea if they would have developed differently or not. Why don't people rant about rushing Hall?

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#94 Butters
April 03 2011, 02:50PM
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I don't understand all the love for VV. He looked OK against a Canucks team that didn't give a crap about Saturday's game.

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#96 Wes Mantooth
April 03 2011, 03:47PM
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Do you have an original thought of your own? Do you just come on and read someone’s post and slam there opinions is that your deal? Why don’t you astonish us with your hockey knowledge then?

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#97 Wes Mantooth
April 03 2011, 03:50PM
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The above post was meant for Steve Smith

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#98 Wes Mantooth
April 03 2011, 04:10PM
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@Steve Smith

It sounds like English, but I can't understand a word you're saying

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#99 Wes Mantooth
April 03 2011, 04:14PM
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@Steve Smith

I like you. You remind me of when I was young and stupid.....

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#100 Wes Mantooth
April 03 2011, 04:16PM
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I'm not being rude. You're just insignificant.

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