TIM THOMAS DISSES WHITE HOUSE

Wanye
January 24 2012 01:38AM

When we first read on the Twitterz that Tim Thomas was skipping out on the traditional "Stanley Cup winners meet the President trip to the White House" we rolled our eyes and wondered what was going through the old boy's head. Now we aren't so sure what to think.

Thomas released a statement on the matter:

"I believe the Federal government has grown out of control, threatening the Rights, Liberties, and Property of the People.

This is being done at the Executive, Legislative, and Judicial level. This is in direct opposition to the Constitution and the Founding Fathers vision for the Federal government.

Because I believe this, today I exercised my right as a Free Citizen, and did not visit the White House. This was not about politics or party, as in my opinion both parties are responsible for the situation we are in as a country. This was about a choice I had to make as an INDIVIDUAL.

This is the only public statement I will be making on this topic.

-- TT"

Now if there is anyone less qualified to speak on matters of politics and protest it is your ol' pal Wanye. But we can set up a bit of a debate on this rare instance when American politics and the NHL collide.

THE ONE SIDE

One can argue that it is a tremendous honour to meet the President of the United States - regardless of your political affiliations or whatever axes you have to grind with the Government. Getting a tour of the White House, meeting the Commander in Chief and presenting him with the obligatory jersey is a once in a lifetime honour that most of us regular Joes couldn't even hope to get.

One could make a convincing case that skipping out on something like this is not only disrespectful to your team but to the United States as a whole. These folks would say that hockey players have no business making protests like this.

Regardless of what you feel you should go to the White House like a good 2011 Cup Champion and keep your mouth shut and smile for the cameras.

ON THE OTHER HAND

 

One could also choose to admire the stance that Thomas has taken. His statement on the matter is amazingly lucid - how many other professional athletes have "excercised their rights as a Free Citizen" in a public manner like this? It also shows a level of awareness and thought - this clearly isn't a simple matter of "I don't like Obama therefore I won't go to the White House."

It raises the visibility of a growing protest against the Government in the US and even made the headlines of our favourite consipiracy/economic blog Zero Hedge. There the support for Thomas in the comments section was very strong - until it devolved into Canucks hating (which was also quite entertaining):

Al Gorerhythm: Well done TT. I hope that it is not your last public statement on these matters though. We need folk in highly visible positions to spread the news. Kudos.

Arkadaba: As a Habs fan - well you know. Kudos to him for taking a stand. And he has a lot to lose like endorsements etc. (which he will). Should be NHL player of the year.

Because of Thomas' protest, this is now making international headlines - here is a take from the Sydney Morning Herald:

"Goaltender Thomas insisted his decision to snub the ceremony with US President Barack Obama, a Democrat, was not a partisan gesture in favour of the opposing Republican party, but a decision based on his belief that the US government has too much influence on American individuals’ lives."

SO WHAT'S YOUR TAKE?

How do you read this whole thing? Do professional athletes have any business making political statements like this? Or should they keep their opinions to themselves and stick to what they know? We would cheerfully ship them to meet the ghost of Kim Jong Il if it meant the Oilers would win the Cup.

But we are a simple minded non-partisan after all.

09049f03ecb006ab29372206f2a88f75
Blog so hard motherf**ckers try and find me. Email me at wanyegretz@gmail.com or tweet me @wanyegretz provided it is about Jordan Eberle or babes.
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#51 Dman09
January 24 2012, 11:36AM
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Romulus' Apotheosis wrote:

Wow politics on ON... what's next religion... how do you all come down on the Council of Nicea? (isn't there something about dinner parties and topics of conversations to avoid...)

anyway... I'll just share a few thoughts

1) the US constitution sets forth a radically different system of governance than Canada and other Constitutional Monarchies (or governments like France and Germany for that matter) that split the Head of State and the Head of Government responsibilities. In the US the President acts as both (although elements of the Head of Government role are shared by Congress).

It's pretty clear that events like these fall under the Head of State role. This role is largely a figure-head (in Can. the Governor General/Queen) and presides over banquets and gives awards, acknowledges achievement in arts, sport, military etc; and has the pride of the nation vested in the office.

One of the benefits of a Constitutional Monarchy, or a system like Germany, or Israel, is that one can honor one's country via the figure-head without engaging in questions of the politics of the day.

In the States, when an event like this is held the Government acts in this capacity... blurring the lines. TT is clearly unable to disentangle the various roles a President of the US is designed by the constitution to play, or refuses to acknowledge this distinction.

2) So far I haven't heard anyone suggest TT can not hold or express his political opinions. That is not the issue. The issue is whether he chose the appropriate venue and target for his protest. I would suggest he did not. The venue is off because it was clearly an apolitical ceremony and the target is off because the President was acting as Head of State.

The issue of a democratic marketplace of ideas is hardly hindered by respecting appropriate venues and targets for political expression.

3) It does not to me show great moral or political courage to protest an inappropriate target at an inappropriate venue. If Lucic (from BC) refused to attend because of the on-going soft-wood lumber trade disputes between Can-US (primarily a BC issue), that would be as absurd and dickish as this performance.

4) The question of "nonpartisanship" seems like a dodge. The issues of the expansion of executive power (in both CAN-US) and the expansion of deficit spending and the debt are hardly partisan issues viewed from cold, objective reality. What is partisan is WHEN people decide the deficit or executive power are serious problems and WHO is in power when these objections are raised.

5) I think it is both disrespectful to his team and his country to act in such a petulant manner. He should take to the streets and the polls to loudly and creatively express his political frustrations.

AND, he should stand with his teammates, look his Head of State in the eye, shake his hand and receive the pride and honor of his country (ie. it was not his government that was honoring him, it was his State).

Two Thumbs up

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#52 Quinn the Eskimo
January 24 2012, 11:38AM
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@Romulus' Apotheosis

3 props.

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#53 Oilcruzer
January 24 2012, 11:39AM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

I bet Dave Hodge could (and does) run naked down the Halls of the TSN studios and receives no punishment from his bosses. I doubt he gets in trouble at all.

You are probably not far off. His exit from CBC years ago was based on his shooting his mouth off.

Retirement looms.

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#54 Romulus' Apotheosis
January 24 2012, 11:48AM
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Sheldon "Oilers Fan for Life!!!" wrote:

Both would embarrass the team etc and both can be patriotic. If he is right and we find our selves with a government similar to Germany in 1939 than we will all wonder why we did not do more. If he is wrong no one will really care in a week or ten years. both carry great risk to Tim Thomas. One carries great risk for us all.

First, any reference to Germany of the Weimar period through the War as an analogy to just about anything has to, by definition, be looked at with extreme skepticism.

Second, I'm guessing - by your other comment:

It may well be true that Tim thinks that Obama and the Dems are the problem but If it is true that we are becoming Germany in 1939 the only difference will be one party wanting a theocracy and the other wanting communism.

that you are ham-fistedly referring to the elections of 1932-3... ie. when the social democrats, nazis and communists stood for election ultimately leading to Hitler's rise to power. None of those parties were theocratic.

And if you mean the republicans and democrats in contemporary US are theocratic and communist respectively... oh boy... i encourage you to read more. A lot more!

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#55 Gus
January 24 2012, 11:51AM
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I just think he could have handled it better. Of course it is anyone and everyone's right to say and do what the feel is right but there are a few things I would have thought twice about if I was in that situation. First of all, it is a ceremonial procedure where the President congratulates the team on their success. It has nothing to do with politics and thus it should be left asisde (which it wasn't no matter what TT states). Secondly, when a prominent figure, in this case TT, refuses to even see the President it fuels all which is bad in today's political environment. We can have different views but it is key that we are able to understand that political views in the US are not personal. Democrats and Republicans should be able to talk to each other and sometimes even be friends. The differences are in policy and should be kept at that.

It's just disturbing when a prominent figure like TT not only refuses to attend a cerimonial event at the White House but also feels the need to go out and justify it in the way he did.

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#56 Romulus' Apotheosis
January 24 2012, 11:52AM
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Dodd wrote:

The real scandal: Dave Hodge of TSN tweeted the "coincidence" that Thomas' children (three of them) names all start with K (KKK). THIS is irresponsible and should not go by un-noticed.

This is way worse than what TT did. Hodge should be tarred and feathered (like the original tea partiers did... only metaphorically this time) for that... super disturbing.

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#57 Time Travelling Sean
January 24 2012, 11:56AM
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I enjoy what Arch said "sits at home and pretends to be a patriot."

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#58 Romulus' Apotheosis
January 24 2012, 12:01PM
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Red wrote:

I think this a bold and commendable move by Tim Thomas. I say hats off to you man, we need more big name celebs to step up and speak their minds. Not that their words have more value then yours mine but because it helps draw attention to the issue. The fact that most people are unaware of the issue is stunning to me. most people only believe what they see on mainstream media and this couldn't be further from reality. People need to be aware of what is happening, we are losing more and more rights by the day in North America, Canada is not exempt from any of this. Harper is quietly aping all of these policies and trying to push them through here. Watch the Thrive movie for the big picture.

www.thrivemovement.com

Look... when you post a link that prominently touts that it has an interview with David Icke... yes this David Icke:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Icke

I'm not inclined to pay much attention to you.

I would - as a side note - encourage you to reflect a bit more on the "draw attention to the issue" = good thing equation. That all depends on what the "issue" is. Jenny McCarthy convincing people to stop taking vaccines and the return among some US populations of whooping cough and other communicable diseases is hardly a good thing.

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#59 Quinn the Eskimo
January 24 2012, 12:10PM
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@Romulus' Apotheosis

Also, Godwin's Law. Sheldon loses automatically.

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#60 mikey
January 24 2012, 12:14PM
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Dear Tim:

Get over yourself

Signed, Everyone.

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#61 Rondo
January 24 2012, 12:35PM
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Tim Thomas does not have to respect the Office of the Presidency.

After what Bill Clinton did in the Oval office (BJ)

The Office Of The Presidency needs to respect us more.

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#62 Time Travelling Sean
January 24 2012, 12:38PM
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He continued nevertheless to develop his ideas, and in four books published over seven years—The Robots' Rebellion (1994), And the Truth Shall Set You Free (1995), The Biggest Secret (1999), and Children of the Matrix (2001)—set out a moral and political worldview that combined New-Age spiritualism with a passionate denunciation of totalitarian trends in the modern world. At the heart of his theories lies the idea that the world is becoming a global fascist state, that a secret group of reptilian humanoids called the Babylonian Brotherhood controls humanity, and that many prominent figures are reptilian, including George H. W. Bush, Queen Elizabeth II, Kris Kristofferson, and Boxcar Willie.

LOL

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#63 Dipstick
January 24 2012, 12:41PM
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Quinn the Eskimo wrote:

Also, Godwin's Law. Sheldon loses automatically.

Huh?

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#64 Romulus' Apotheosis
January 24 2012, 12:46PM
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Dipstick wrote:

Huh?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

also....

somewhat related to topic at hand:

http://www.boston.com/Boston/politicalintelligence/2012/01/john-kerry-the-right-wing-breaks-nose/OB5yFHBZFexEMpEibSnxpL/index.html

I thought that was kind of funny.

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#65 VK63
January 24 2012, 12:52PM
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When do the Oilers play again?

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#66 Milhouse Van Ched
January 24 2012, 12:59PM
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Rondo wrote:

Tim Thomas does not have to respect the Office of the Presidency.

After what Bill Clinton did in the Oval office (BJ)

The Office Of The Presidency needs to respect us more.

Bush Jr. did far worse in that office then Clinton did!

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#67 Douche Nietzsche
January 24 2012, 01:03PM
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@Archaeologuy

Obama is not the leader of Thomas' country, he's like our Tambellini. You come across as more of an idiot than Thomas could ever be, disresceting him for exercising his right and opinion.

If his team don't like it, they can get rid of him. Attendance is not manditory.

Cowardly? Really? What would him whispering it in Obamas ear done? Nothing. Obama has already heard enough from the occupy hippies, he don't care. I admire what Thomas did, and I don't think he's a coward in any strench of imagination.

Most powerful man? Come on buddy, get back to your Star Wars.

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#68 Douche Nietzsche
January 24 2012, 01:13PM
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vetinari wrote:

Thomas should appreciate that he lives in a country where you can publicly state your opposition to the machinery of government and yet live to tell the tale!

People are dying all over the world to enjoy the freedoms and liberties that Thomas presently enjoys (availability of college and education, free market system that rewards him with an annual salary that is greater than the average workers lifetime of wages, etc.) yet he is silent about that.

It is further intersting that he doesn't articulate how his freedoms are presently affected or what the "founding fathers" vision was.

Thomas is entitled to his views and to not engage the Preseidnet of the United States, however, by making a broad decalartion in the manner in which he did, I think he has to be prepared to elaborate and explain what the heck he was actually protesting.

What planet do you live on?

Americas kids are dying around the world while their freedoms are being being stolen from them in their home country. Heard of the patroit act? Awareness and knowledge are not two of the same.

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#69 Time Travelling Sean
January 24 2012, 01:18PM
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Oh I remember reading something and this guy said something like this "Our kids go halfway across the world to fight for democracy and we can't cross the street to vote"

And there was another remark "An assassination of a leader isn't going to kill democracy, instead a chronic apathy shall be the end of democracy"

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#70 Chaz
January 24 2012, 01:30PM
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Way to make it all about you Tim. You really put the Douche in Douchebaggery....

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#71 Dipstick
January 24 2012, 01:47PM
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@Romulus' Apotheosis

Sorry, I missed the Nazi reference. I did not think that Hodge's KKK inference qualified.

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#72 Archaeologuy
January 24 2012, 01:48PM
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@Douche Nietzsche

Please. Whining at home while eating Cheetos is no less cowardly than getting your mom to sign a note excusing you from Track & Field day in the 9th grade.

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#73 Romulus' Apotheosis
January 24 2012, 01:54PM
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Dipstick wrote:

Sorry, I missed the Nazi reference. I did not think that Hodge's KKK inference qualified.

Hodge's KKK reference qualified for a lot of things but not for a Godwin's Law reference. That was reserved for Comment

#24:

Both would embarrass the team etc and both can be patriotic. If he is right and we find our selves with a government similar to Germany in 1939 than we will all wonder why we did not do more. If he is wrong no one will really care in a week or ten years. both carry great risk to Tim Thomas. One carries great risk for us all.

and comment #25:

It may well be true that Tim thinks that Obama and the Dems are the problem but If it is true that we are becoming Germany in 1939 the only difference will be one party wanting a theocracy and the other wanting communism.

For the record, I found these comments more confusing than offensive or anything and I said as much above in comment #54.

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#74 traveling howdy
January 24 2012, 03:47PM
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It's funny that he thinks there is something wrong with American society. How about the fact that a hockey player can make in one year what it would take the average American citizen150 years to make

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#75 Aaron
January 24 2012, 04:54PM
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How dare Tim Thomas let the US constitution and the peoples rights to a free and fair society get in the way of a afternoon get together at the White House. Every one here today has witnessed something that should be eerily sobering. I think we can all say that we like to watch Hockey. It is that still small voice that tells you to do something to protect your rights and freedoms and put entertainment second. History shows us that freedom can be taken away and now God has given us Tim Thomas as another canary in the coal mind will we ignore him at our countries Pearle. I dare say I hope not. For those who say everything is okay I send you here infowars.com to see what the corporate media leaves out of your daily news. God bless us all we are past the 7th inning stretch so head this warning and protect your freedoms if not for you then the next generation.

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#76 justDOit
January 24 2012, 05:05PM
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Good for Tim.

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#77 Quinn the Eskimo
January 24 2012, 05:05PM
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I heard this comparison today on Team 1040 radio: What Timmy did is analogous to not showing up at your sister's wedding because you don't like what the Catholic church gets up to. It's not about you, it's about your sister and the family. If you don't show up you look like a d*ck.

If you run Thomas' facebook comment through the Gingrich-Beck DogWhistle Translator 2000 (tm), 'The government is too big and threatens life and property' turns out as 'the government is too black and I don't want to pay any taxes.'

I bet the Bruin's room is a bit quieter today.

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#78 Aaron
January 24 2012, 06:59PM
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Quinn the Eskimo wrote:

I heard this comparison today on Team 1040 radio: What Timmy did is analogous to not showing up at your sister's wedding because you don't like what the Catholic church gets up to. It's not about you, it's about your sister and the family. If you don't show up you look like a d*ck.

If you run Thomas' facebook comment through the Gingrich-Beck DogWhistle Translator 2000 (tm), 'The government is too big and threatens life and property' turns out as 'the government is too black and I don't want to pay any taxes.'

I bet the Bruin's room is a bit quieter today.

Quinn the Eskimo your right its not about you its about what is happening in our halls of power. It's about sacrifice when will you decide it is time to sacrifice Quinn? When?

Quinn is a shining example of what not do when your Government is sold to the highest bidder and that is to crucify those who are brave enough and vigilant enough to see the totalitarian tiptoe that has turned into a totalitarian sprint and warn us at their own peril. Quinn your deception and deceit have been seen by all on here and I pray that God opens yours eyes and that we all repent.

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#79 Wäx Män Riley
January 24 2012, 09:20PM
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Props Tim Thomas.

I read comments that he doesn't know what he is talking about, and is an idiot, and it is a selfish move, etc....

When I see a country give no jail time to a group that murdered 24 people in cold blood,. I have to think, especially because he is American, that he has a great point.

Of course it was political. When he said that it wasn't, he was talking about it not being toward either party, but the entire system.

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#80 thebiggestmanintheworld
January 24 2012, 09:31PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

People are stupid. They have a right to be stupid, but it doesnt make them less stupid.

Believe what you want. It doesnt mean you're right. I could sing Koombaya, hold hands, and eat granola bars with everybody who thinks all ideas are created equal, but I wont. They arent all equal. You have every right to believe them and I wont argue that at all. But believing in fairies, dragons, and libertarian values is a right that the idiots inherited from smarter people.

Thomas wasnt asked to shake hands with Putin or Pierre Maguire. He was asked to shake hands with the President of his own country. It's his right not to go. It's my right to call him an idiot.

Fair enough.

I just don't see why its such a big deal.

Then again, I choose not to get involved in other countries politics.

I'm not sure where you're going with the fairies and dragons bit but then again, I don't really know what Thomas's political beliefs are. I'm not supporting his beliefs, just his right to have them.

If he believes in dragons, fine. I don't, but I won't call him an idiot or stupid.

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#81 Aaron
January 24 2012, 10:00PM
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Archaeologuy wrote:

Please. Whining at home while eating Cheetos is no less cowardly than getting your mom to sign a note excusing you from Track & Field day in the 9th grade.

Archaeologuy whats your freedom worth to you?

Is worth a visit to the white house?

Is worth looking bad in some peoples eyes that may not know the extent of the corruption and where it is heading?

Why is this happening? is it good and evil or is it a stock market correction?

Some questions all of us need to start asking because all of this as been predicted in the bible and by the way the Davinci Code was purposely made to destroy your faith in Jesus Christ and I would suggest you look into the prophecy club for they knew this was coming...

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#82 Time Travelling Sean
January 24 2012, 10:13PM
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Aaron wrote:

Archaeologuy whats your freedom worth to you?

Is worth a visit to the white house?

Is worth looking bad in some peoples eyes that may not know the extent of the corruption and where it is heading?

Why is this happening? is it good and evil or is it a stock market correction?

Some questions all of us need to start asking because all of this as been predicted in the bible and by the way the Davinci Code was purposely made to destroy your faith in Jesus Christ and I would suggest you look into the prophecy club for they knew this was coming...

Always enjoy a good conspiracy theory.

Although I think he put himself in front of his team, for his own political views. Kinda selfish, although as it has been stated 100 million times, he has the right to do so.

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#83 OILERSORDEATH
January 24 2012, 10:28PM
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yeah way to go Tim you stupid inbred tea baggin dumb sh!t!! Classless

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#84 Simple Simon
January 24 2012, 10:49PM
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It is easy to point the finger at someone who stands up for what they believe in. It’s also easy to buckle under any time the going gets tough or when someone is going to judge you for your beliefs. I applaud Thomas for not sacrificing his integrity as a man by saying one thing but doing another. As for his team mates I think they should applaud him as well. It is that type of man that you want to go in to battle with.    Tim Thomas did not use his status or this opportunity as a soap box. He made a clear and concise statement to explain his actions and left it at that. Whether you agree with his beliefs or not, you can not question his character.  

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#85 Simple Simon
January 24 2012, 11:01PM
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Those of you saying that he's a db or made it all about him have probably never truly stood for or believed in anything strongly enough to allow him or herself to be judged and persicuted for it. Take a good look in the mirror and ask yourself if you have the courage to do what you believe in on the world stage versus what's popular. I bet not.

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#86 spOILer
January 25 2012, 02:00AM
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Arch said

But believing in fairies, dragons, and libertarian values is a right that the idiots inherited from smarter people.

Wow, guilt by being associated in the same sentence. That's some kind of logic. You do yourself a discredit sir. You're right, ideas aren't equal. You just proved it by offering up this crap as an argument. But perhaps at least you understand that Thomas' protest is because of the very reason that ideas aren't equal nor are events. And some ideas are very very important and some events get a helluva lot of attention.

Kudos to Thomas and further kudos to Zero Hedge for running it (possibly the best site on the internet and thus I'm stunned Wanye reads it).

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#87 HOZ
January 25 2012, 07:13AM
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I would have gone if I was in his position. It all about team, family, community.

BUT

I support Tim Thomas for making his position clear. Big Trudeaupean governments suck the life out everyone. Big govs are sucky suckitudial sucky!

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#88 Archaeologuy
January 25 2012, 08:10AM
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@Aaron

Dont you worry about my Faith in Jesus Christ, Aaron, that went out the window a long time ago. Dan Brown's fiction novel wasnt needed to put that baby to rest.

Freedoms? Do you honestly believe that Tim Thomas' freedoms are at stake here?

Crazy Old Arch isnt the only one unimpressed by this display of "Courage". The owner of the Bruins is reportedly irate over this debacle.

But seriously thou.....ARGGGGH......CLAAAAAACCCKKK....

*Gurgling noises*

.....Sorry, that was the chip in my brain acting up again. It was placed there in '96 so it still has a dial up modem attached to it. Somebody must have tried to make a phone call on the wrong line...

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#89 madjam
January 25 2012, 08:24AM
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Thomas's loss, but teams embarrassment . He should have kept his mouth shut and just not shown up leaving team to give a "canned answer " for his absence . This was not reflective of his team, and put them all in an unfavorable position of trying to defend his speaking out in that manner . Politics has, and probably always will, mix with sports and entertainment in general . Thomas is entitled to his own personal opinions , but he should learn when to shut up when his actions effect and are reflective of the rest of his teammates and organization .

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#90 Aaron
January 25 2012, 09:20PM
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madjam wrote:

Thomas's loss, but teams embarrassment . He should have kept his mouth shut and just not shown up leaving team to give a "canned answer " for his absence . This was not reflective of his team, and put them all in an unfavorable position of trying to defend his speaking out in that manner . Politics has, and probably always will, mix with sports and entertainment in general . Thomas is entitled to his own personal opinions , but he should learn when to shut up when his actions effect and are reflective of the rest of his teammates and organization .

It is great we have a place where we can debate and speak on these matters. Tim's stand on his Governments relentless assault on their Constitution which is similar to our Government taking away our charter of rights and freedoms. Now If this does not qualify for reason to miss the whitehouse tea party what does. Maybe the simpsons or MTV awards? Please enlighten me what am I missing. One more thing

I am with my family it is a beautiful day we are heading to the lake. Finally this trip that we have planned for months is coming together. We start putting the supplies in the yacht and I see a small leak and there is a good chance it will spread? What do you do? 1- Don't say anything and go for this trip it is to important to cancel now the food will spoil and if the leak gets worse we will be okay because we have our life jackets.

2- Or do you face facts and Tell the family the trip will have to wait until the leak is properly fixed and that our safety comes first.

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