A SOFT DEADLINE?

Jason Gregor
December 20 2012 09:50AM

The NHLPA still hasn't decided if they will file a disclaimer of interest. Do you think it would take four days for them to vote on a proposal that included 54% HRR from the league and no cap on contract length? This is just another laughable step in an inexcusable lockout.

The best part is we all know we are getting closer to a decision regarding the 2013 season and yesterday Bill Daly admitted as much on HNIC radio.

Yesterday on HNIC radio Bill Daly was asked by Elliott Friedman if there would be a season, he answered "Yes." He was instructed that he could only say yes or no, so yes was the obvious choice, but that wasn't the comment that grabbed my attention. 

"I don't think setting an absolute [drop dead] date serves a purpose [in negotiations] at this point, but certainly everybody knows the neighbourhood we're talking about," he said when discussing a possible cancellation date.

That neighbourhood is likely between January 10th-15th. If they don't have a deal by then they won't be able to have training camp and play 48 games. With the NHL and their Keystone Cop routine at the conclusion of every CBA, we can't rule out them playing 41 games, so it is possible this could drag out until the end of January, but I still feel the 10th to the 15th is the final window if they plan on playing 48 games. (I'm sure according to governance of the league they can't have fewer than 48 games, but I will double-check that.)

The question is would it benefit either side to put in a drop dead date?

I think it would.

It would force both sides to get back to the negotiating table, because if they didn't their sponsors and fans would be more livid than they are now. Maybe I'm the naive one in thinking the NHL and NHLPA are aware of the damage they are doing to the game and their reputation, but they must realize that another cancelled season will cost both sides millions and possibly billions in the future.

It seems both parties are waiting for the other to blink, and if you put in a drop dead date that would force them to actually negotiate if they want to save the season. Sadly neither side is interested in trying to jump-start negotiations, because they are fearful any new proposal will be viewed as a sign of weakness. It's beyond embarrassing at this point.

The other great part about a drop dead date is that we'd all have some closure. I'm guessing most of you still want a season, but having an end date would give us something to look forward to. I doubt it happens, because the NHL and NHLPA have zero interest in pleasing their fans or sponsors at this moment.

WILLIS FIRED UP

Is the lockout getting to Willis? He unleashed some venom yesterday towards those who don't believe in shooting percentage. It was a good read, and nice to see some passion.

It is true that Pisani and Brule never produced like they did in the 2006 postseason and 2010 season respectively, but suggesting that an inflated SH% was the obvious red-flag might be simplifying things a bit.

I think Pisani's battle with ulcerative colitis might have played a bigger part in his demise than his SH%. His 2006 heroics were incredible, and most sane people didn't expect him to score that frequently. I also would think that considering he scored 18 goals in 2006 that suggesting he'd be a 20-goal scorer in 2007 wasn't that outrageous.

Brule's lack of production came mostly from his lack of confidence between his ears and his inability to stay healthy. It is true his SH% dipped, but so did his games played and his icetime.

I believe that advanced statistics have helped in the evaluation process of a player; however, they aren't perfect or always accurate just like scouts, media or fans who just watch the game.

I recall many stats guys suggesting there was no way Ryan Jones could match his 18 goal and 25 points of 2011. Last year he tallied 17 goals and 33 points.

I'm all for using stats, and I think they give an insightful different perspective, but they also have flaws. Which only helps to make the debate of what a player might become more entertaining.

DAY FOURTEEN

Yesterday we raised $4,650 due to some great bids by Michael, Brian and Darryl. Thanks guys. Today we will also be auctioning off three packages.

 Item One: A Premium Heavy Duty Sprayed in Bedliner and an Undercoat courtesy of Armaguard. It can be for any type of truck.

 Item Two: A signed and framed Keepers of the Cup courtesy of Pro Am Sports.

 

ITEM three: For the handyman or handywoman. $1,000 in Rona gift cards donated by me. I recieved these for raising money last year and since you helped raise the money, it is only fair to use it to raise more money.

 

 

All of the proceeds will go towards Santas Anonymous and the Christmas Bureau. Bidding goes from 2 p.m. to 5:55 p.m and you can call 780.426.8326 or text 101260 to bid. Thanks in advance. 

RECENTLY BY JASON GREGOR 

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One of Canada's most versatile sports personalities. Jason hosts The Jason Gregor Show, weekdays from 2 to 6 p.m., on TSN 1260, and he writes a column every Monday in the Edmonton Journal. You can follow him on Twitter at twitter.com/JasonGregor
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#1 They're $hittie
December 20 2012, 11:12AM
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Even if there are infinite amount of parellel universes. There still wouldnt be one in which the canucks have won a stanley cup.

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#2 6 ring circus
December 20 2012, 10:06AM
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I hope they cancel the season!!!The greed that both the NHLPA and NHL have shown, I could care less.It is very obvious that both sides do not care about the fans.I am going to spend the money I save from my season tickets on a family vacation.

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#3 BigE91
December 20 2012, 12:34PM
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Just want to give huge PROPS to Gregor for the Month of Giving.

Here's to all those who step up this time of year and all year long for that matter to give those around them a helping hand!

Merry Christmas Nation.

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#4 hunkybill
December 20 2012, 01:51PM
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Pronounced in Ukrainian, NHL can "pucha loy moy sraha". I'm gonna go smoke a FATTY!

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#5 DSF
December 20 2012, 10:35AM
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Hockey Is Ours!

http://youtu.be/mQ4JTjFcU7Q

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#6 cableguy - 2nd Tier Fan
December 20 2012, 12:39PM
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james_dean wrote:

So my grandfather is 86 years old and he was volunteering at a soup kitchen downtown on skid row.

I young man came in demanding a gift for his kids on top of being fed. " you ruined my life because of your heritage"

A nice way of putting it.

He piped up and told him "after I feed you im going to work!" The 20 something year old man came over the counter and shoved the 86 year old man to the ground.

after he feeds the less priveliged, he goes to work as a plumber for his own business.

You guessed it, pops aint allowed in there anymore while the kid goes there everyday to eat. Too lazy to work.

Talk about respect for your elders.

Needless to say I watch what chatitys I donate to now.

Happy ho ho nation

i feel the logical next step is to blame horcoff

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#7 Kent Wilson
December 20 2012, 10:07AM
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I recall many stats guys suggesting there was no way Ryan Jones could match his 18 goal and 25 points of 2011. Last year he tallied 17 goals and 33 points.

Actually, if I remember correctly, the fight was more over how effective Jones is as a player overall (scores, but the team gives up goals/chances the other way when he's on the ice). His SH% has been more or less right in line with his career average ever year.

There is lots still to suss out and debate when it comes to advanced stats since most of this stuff is still in its infancy. Regression to the mean is something you can almost always take to the bank over the long-term though. The only guy I've seen manage a career high SH% one season and then beat that again the next recently is Curtis Glencross...and I'm willing to bet he comes back down to Earth whenever hockey picks up again.

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#8 Sanaa Montana
December 20 2012, 01:09PM
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james_dean wrote:

So my grandfather is 86 years old and he was volunteering at a soup kitchen downtown on skid row.

I young man came in demanding a gift for his kids on top of being fed. " you ruined my life because of your heritage"

A nice way of putting it.

He piped up and told him "after I feed you im going to work!" The 20 something year old man came over the counter and shoved the 86 year old man to the ground.

after he feeds the less priveliged, he goes to work as a plumber for his own business.

You guessed it, pops aint allowed in there anymore while the kid goes there everyday to eat. Too lazy to work.

Talk about respect for your elders.

Needless to say I watch what chatitys I donate to now.

Happy ho ho nation

Cocaine is a hell of a drug.!..

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#9 Rick
December 20 2012, 10:13AM
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Regarding the PA's vote.

Did I hear right the other night on your show that the vote is conducted by the PA's player personalized e-mail system?

Talk about rigging a result.

Who in the right mind would watch the Hamrlik fallout and then willingly choose to go against the hardliners in a non anonymous vote?

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#10 Dave Lumley
December 20 2012, 10:16AM
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Daly can't give the date out. If he does Fehr will wait for the last offer from the NHL and then pull another one of his "we are really, really, really close this time" routines and hammer the owners one last time.

As for Pisani's contract, I don't think the Oilers expected the same shootinig % but rather thought they had one of those special playoff clutch guys who everyone is after. I am sure the management thought we would be regular playoff teamfor years to come.

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#11 Will
December 20 2012, 10:27AM
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Thank you for bringing this up. I've had this fight with Willis before, to no avail. Doesn't it seem that the advanced shooting percentage stat only helps people argue that players were lucky? That's what these arguments boil down to don't they,"hey everyone, Eberle had a shooting percentage red flag, so that means he was just lucky last year, and won't have as many points this year."

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#12 OilClog
December 20 2012, 10:34AM
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Glencross is no Eberle.

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#13 Fresh Mess
December 20 2012, 10:52AM
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Not a fan of the advanced stats craze. Almost makes me wish 'Moneyball' (great book and film) had never been released.

The players union loses credibility with each passing week. Their refusal to allow secret ballot votes on offers from the league, intimidation of members not willing to tow the line, personal insults hurled at their bosses, and a sham week long player "vote" on a motion that is supposed to be solely up to the discretion of union leadership are turning the public away from them in droves.

Btw, I am sick and tired of hearing twentysomething-year old players publicly referring to the NHL Commissioner as "Gary" or "Bettman". It's 'The Commissioner' or 'Mr. Bettman' to you chumps. You are not his peers. Learn your place and learn some respect.

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#14 T__Bone88
December 20 2012, 11:04AM
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There can be a pro and a con to setting a deadline date. If the NHL sets that date as Jan 10th the players will know that's that in regards to a season and no other offers will come to save a season. On the flip side the players can hold out until the 9th to receive the best possible deal instead of accepting a lesser deal now which would allow more games to be played and let both NHL and players recover some losses.

Looking at the Sportsnet lock out clock so far there is $652 million loss on 453 non played games out of a total 1230 possible games played. 453 games equates to 30 games per team. If Jan 1st was the start date and had a 56 game season the lost games would only be 390 and $596 million lost (based on players still getting 57% of $3.3 billion). If the owners still left the $300 million on table of which $250 million goes back to salary then players only lose $346 million in total or $461333 per player (750 players). Like the retired players say if the players keep holding out for a better deal it keeps getting worse.

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#15 dman09
December 20 2012, 11:46AM
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I don't think the players actually realize that their HRR in the next few years is now going to be a lot less that they expect especially is the season is cancelled. Sponsors are going to drop like flies and the HRR along with it. It would not surprise me to see a 40% Reduction do to this situation. They players keep fighting for more money but they don't realize the longer this goes the less the will get regardless of the CBA that is signed. That 3 billion is going to drop to 2 billion or less. Sponsers will spend their money on baseball, football, and Basketball because they are more dependable.

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#16 book¡e
December 20 2012, 11:51AM
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Rick wrote:

Regarding the PA's vote.

Did I hear right the other night on your show that the vote is conducted by the PA's player personalized e-mail system?

Talk about rigging a result.

Who in the right mind would watch the Hamrlik fallout and then willingly choose to go against the hardliners in a non anonymous vote?

Unfortunatly, this is how unions work. I don't have a problem with unions as a concept, but the reality of them is that they are all brutish organizations where a small group of radical greedy individuals indoctrinate the most ignorant members of the group who then bully the more moderate majority into stupid actions.

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#17 dman09
December 20 2012, 11:59AM
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book¡e wrote:

Unfortunatly, this is how unions work. I don't have a problem with unions as a concept, but the reality of them is that they are all brutish organizations where a small group of radical greedy individuals indoctrinate the most ignorant members of the group who then bully the more moderate majority into stupid actions.

Thats what it is now. The whole purpose of Unions was to protect people who were being treating unfairly like during the industrial revolution. Now labor laws are in place so there is no need for Unions and under no circumstances should people who make millions a year require a union to protect them from unfair labor practices.

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#18 james_dean
December 20 2012, 12:04PM
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So my grandfather is 86 years old and he was volunteering at a soup kitchen downtown on skid row.

I young man came in demanding a gift for his kids on top of being fed. " you ruined my life because of your heritage"

A nice way of putting it.

He piped up and told him "after I feed you im going to work!" The 20 something year old man came over the counter and shoved the 86 year old man to the ground.

after he feeds the less priveliged, he goes to work as a plumber for his own business.

You guessed it, pops aint allowed in there anymore while the kid goes there everyday to eat. Too lazy to work.

Talk about respect for your elders.

Needless to say I watch what chatitys I donate to now.

Happy ho ho nation

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#19 Sanaa Montana
December 20 2012, 01:00PM
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6 ring circus wrote:

I hope they cancel the season!!!The greed that both the NHLPA and NHL have shown, I could care less.It is very obvious that both sides do not care about the fans.I am going to spend the money I save from my season tickets on a family vacation.

What greed has the NHL shown?

Too many teams in the NHL are losing money, and most of them are supported(and league as a whole) by the 6 CND teams. The league needs a fixing and player contracts are included in that.

NHL needs to care about money before they care about the fans. If there is no money for them to put the game out, then there is no game that people can call themselves a fans of.

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#20 Time Travelling Sean
December 20 2012, 01:03PM
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Too many NHL teams were shoved into unsustainable markets. It isn't the players fault. If there was a 2nd team in TO and one more in Quebec and another in Seattle that's probably 3 teams making more money than the losses of all the teams losing money.

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#21 Sanaa Montana
December 20 2012, 01:07PM
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book¡e wrote:

Unfortunatly, this is how unions work. I don't have a problem with unions as a concept, but the reality of them is that they are all brutish organizations where a small group of radical greedy individuals indoctrinate the most ignorant members of the group who then bully the more moderate majority into stupid actions.

Isn't the whole purpose of the unions to fight of the brutish organizations of small greedy individuals from indoctrinating them into ignorant stupid actions?

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#22 K_Mart
December 20 2012, 03:54PM
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Kent Wilson wrote:

I recall many stats guys suggesting there was no way Ryan Jones could match his 18 goal and 25 points of 2011. Last year he tallied 17 goals and 33 points.

Actually, if I remember correctly, the fight was more over how effective Jones is as a player overall (scores, but the team gives up goals/chances the other way when he's on the ice). His SH% has been more or less right in line with his career average ever year.

There is lots still to suss out and debate when it comes to advanced stats since most of this stuff is still in its infancy. Regression to the mean is something you can almost always take to the bank over the long-term though. The only guy I've seen manage a career high SH% one season and then beat that again the next recently is Curtis Glencross...and I'm willing to bet he comes back down to Earth whenever hockey picks up again.

If you're a betting man than regression to the mean is always the safe(and smart)bet. The beauty of this debate are the odd outliers here and there that continually allow the fanatics to cling to hope.

Also... when you say the only guy you've seen manage to put up a career high sh% one year then top it the next is Curtis Glencross, how many seasons does a player have to play pro for in order to be analysed? I ask because technically every player puts up a career high their first year, and more than one player has produced a higher sh% than they did in their rookie campaign. 3 season minimum?

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#23 I'm a Scientist!
December 20 2012, 04:24PM
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So since the league is cancelling games in 2-week chunks...and doing so almost a month in advance, a CBA would have to be in place before the BEGINNING of January... no? I don't see them cancelling the season January 14th (must need to give rinks, sponsors, etc. notice of the cancellation) Right?

So... maybe something concrete in the next couple weeks, one way or the other?

Le Sigh.

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#24 book¡e
December 20 2012, 04:58PM
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Sanaa Montana wrote:

Isn't the whole purpose of the unions to fight of the brutish organizations of small greedy individuals from indoctrinating them into ignorant stupid actions?

That was the intent - I don't have any problem with the NHLPA having a group to represent their interests. It makes total sense in a situation like the NHL, but I don't like how these groups tend to employ bullying.

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#25 Wax Man Riley
December 20 2012, 05:05PM
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DSF wrote:

Hockey Is Ours!

http://youtu.be/mQ4JTjFcU7Q

Thanks, DSF!

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#26 Oiler Al
December 20 2012, 05:12PM
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@Fresh Mess

He as been called worse!

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#27 David S
December 20 2012, 06:03PM
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cableguy - 2nd Tier Fan wrote:

i feel the logical next step is to blame horcoff

I personally blame Eberle's UNSUSTAINABLE shooting percentage.

*Fires up MS Excel. Leans back and wonders at the infinite beauty and unbound possibilities of a fresh, clean spreadsheet.*

*Slaps self back to reality.*

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#28 F@#k the NHL
December 20 2012, 06:26PM
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Who gives a Sh#t? Half seasons don't count. Lets boycott them. No live games. No paraphernalia. No pay per view. who's coming with me?

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#29 DSF
December 20 2012, 06:27PM
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Wax Man Riley wrote:

Thanks, DSF!

YW.

It's a great video.

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#30 DSF
December 20 2012, 06:38PM
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Daren Millard @darenmillard Confirmed the @nhlpa is planning an outdoor game on Lake Louise for february if a cba can't be worked out.

Great idea!

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#31 The Resistance
December 20 2012, 08:59PM
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Like I bin sayin... Scrap the regular season and do a 30 team, 1 game elimination playoff for the big drink.... Win and you advance, lose and you go home... Kinda like march madness. Hmmm??? Could it work?

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#32 dougtheslug
December 20 2012, 11:25PM
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The most chilling moment in this video? Ovechkin at :34. With the Olympics in Sochi, I sadly fear that this fiercely patriotic Russian, along with a boatload of his compatriots, will not be coming back to the NHL. The NHL's loss, the KHL's gain. Thanks, Gary

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#33 Sanaa Montana
December 21 2012, 12:50AM
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F@#k the NHL wrote:

Who gives a Sh#t? Half seasons don't count. Lets boycott them. No live games. No paraphernalia. No pay per view. who's coming with me?

No one.

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#34 cableguy - 2nd Tier Fan
December 21 2012, 07:40AM
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F@#k the NHL wrote:

Who gives a Sh#t? Half seasons don't count. Lets boycott them. No live games. No paraphernalia. No pay per view. who's coming with me?

i will join you in your pay per view boycott!

NO PAY PER VIEW OILER GAMES! LETS SHOW THEM!

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#35 nunyour
December 21 2012, 03:58PM
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F@#k the NHL wrote:

Who gives a Sh#t? Half seasons don't count. Lets boycott them. No live games. No paraphernalia. No pay per view. who's coming with me?

count me in,and all my season ticket money can go towards next year,i'm not interested in a half season either.cancell the season allready!!!

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