Why is Oklahoma struggling?

Jonathan Willis
December 28 2012 10:31AM

With Oklahoma’s win over Texas on Thursday, the team’s record moves to 15-10-4, one game over 0.500. While it’s better than the other side of the win/loss line, it isn’t what was expected out of a team that has (for most of the year) boasted a trio of high-end NHL’ers up front, the AHL’s best player on the blue line, and the reigning AHL goalie of the year.

What’s the problem?

Honestly, it’s a difficult question and despite watching this team from day one I don’t have a solid answer. I have some ideas, but that’s it.

Depth. This is an area where the Barons have had some problems, both up front and on the blue line. There has been a lot of talk about how prospects like Anton Lander, Tyler Pitlick and Curtis Hamilton aren’t getting power play time and so there needs to be an asterisk next to their absurdly low offensive totals, but these are guys struggling to tread water in depth roles. Pitlick and Hamilton are both minus players in largely third-line minutes; Lander’s performance has surged since being assigned regularly to the top-six but he was a minus player earlier in the year.

On the blue line, Justin Schultz currently sports a plus-14 rating, meaning that the Barons are minus-8 when he is not on the ice. With rookie Martin Marincin imploding, the team’s top left-shooting defenceman these days is ECHL call-up Nathan Deck. Colten Teubert has added muscle but has been just okay defensively; Taylor Fedun has had good moments and bad moments. Schultz might be the league’s best player, but the supporting cast is anemic.

The penalty kill. Given the talent on the team, it should be unsurprising that the Barons are lethal with the man advantage. Unfortunately, the dysfunctional penalty kill has given everything back: the Barons have the best power play and the worst penalty kill in the AHL. The strange thing is that in 2011-12 the Barons had the league’s second-best penalty-killing unit, and on paper a group that includes Chris VandeVelde, Anton Lander, Dane Byers, Tanner House and Magnus Paajarvi should be strong in that department.

The limited impact of the individual. It’s pretty hard to harshly critique any of the four stars playing in Oklahoma. Justin Schultz is the presumptive AHL MVP at this point, and if he wasn’t Jordan Eberle would be. Ryan Nugent-Hopkins is plus-7 and better than a point-per-game player; after a slow start coming back from surgery Taylor Hall has scored nine times and added 14 assists over his last 15 games.

But while all four play big minutes for Oklahoma, the team has used 33 different players. Even in a feature role, they aren’t on the ice all the time, and even the best stars can’t make up entirely for a weak team.

The Bottom Line

Despite the weaknesses on the roster, there’s no way the Barons should be mired near the playoff bubble. The penalty kill should not be stuck in last place. The second-tier prospects should not be collapsing the way they have. Dane Byers should not be a five point guy. A team that has boasted Eberle, Hall, Nugent-Hopkins, Hartikainen and Paajarvi as five of its top six for the majority of the year should not be struggling the way it has. The Barons have been handed a huge advantage this year, and they appear to be squandering it.

A farm team is supposed to find the balance between winning and development. The Barons aren’t winning enough and outside of the phenoms they aren’t looking especially good from a development angle either. It’s a problem.

Recently by Jonathan Willis

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Jonathan Willis is a freelance writer. He currently works for Oilers Nation, Sportsnet, the Edmonton Journal and Bleacher Report. He's co-written three books and worked for myriad websites, including Grantland, ESPN, The Score, and Hockey Prospectus. He was previously the founder and managing editor of Copper & Blue.
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#51 DSF
December 28 2012, 05:16PM
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victor wrote:

Sorry, if it's not Minny, surely it must be Vancouver?

Sure, they have the Sedins for one season at 11% of the cap (each), and Garrison and Ballard for 15% of the cap, but Garrison's finally fixed his groin, and Ballard could recover (regress to the mean?)

From where I sit, it looks like they plan on paying 16% of the cap to goaltenders, but they're well managed.

Oh, yeah, what's the magical deal that will have Luongo go to another team without taking on cap space?

Vancouver has some issues but trading Luongo and Raymond and buying out Ballard fixes their problems.

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#52 DSF
December 28 2012, 05:17PM
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commonfan14 wrote:

Minny could also go to whatever team is sniffing around Luongo and offer them Backstrom instead, then go with Harding and Hackett.

Yep.

Minny will be just fine.

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#53 DSF
December 28 2012, 05:18PM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:
Paajarvi already makes $1.525 million.

No he doesn't.

Yes he does:

http://www.capgeek.com/oilers/

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#54 Oilertown
December 28 2012, 05:22PM
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DSF wrote:

Speaks to your last post JW.

The depth behind the young NHL stars just isn't very good.

While you can make an argument the supporting cast is not getting opportunity, the best forwards outside that core group are Arcobello, Paajarvi and Hartikainen who have all had their numbers pumped by playing with the big four and getting significant PP time.

Remove the stars and the whole thing could collapse.

Also worth noting is how much of the Barons' scoring has been on the PP and, if you consider, once the NHL season gets going, it's likely the top PP could feature Paajarvi, Arcobello and someone like Pitlcik with Marinicin and Fedun, it's likely going to be a pop gun offence.

I wouldn't say PRV and Hartikeinens numbers have been pumped by the big 3 considering they have been on their own line with Lander the last 7 or 8 games and have been playing quite well.

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#55 victor
December 28 2012, 05:30PM
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DSF wrote:

Yes he does:

http://www.capgeek.com/oilers/

You should check his salary, not his cap hit. Unless you think he's entitled to an increase for hitting his bonuses?

PS: Magically trading Luongo and Raymond, and buying out Ballard isn't going to fix the Canucks. Sad, but Gillis really screwed them, should have moved Luongo before staring down the barrel of a $60m cap.

PPS: To the original posting by JW, wasn't it here that posters were commenting that you don't draft and develop 3rd liners? Who cares about the Pitlick's and Martindales, they're a dime-a-dozen, or so I've heard. Better to develop top 2 line talent, and top minutes players, and fill in with veterans. Isn't that right?

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#56 DSF
December 28 2012, 05:35PM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:

You forgot about: Buffalo, Carolina, Chicago, LA, Montreal (Already over 60M signed), Nashville, New York, Pittsburgh, Tampa....

There are only a handful of teams who do not have a similar problem.

I should also mention - I love that you consider raw rookies an automatically perfect solution for cheap players but teams signing veterans in a buyers market are screwed.

Buffalo: $49.6 M committed to the cap.

Carolina: $50.7M

Chicago: $57M

LA: $49.4

Montreal: $60M (will buy out Gomez)

Nashville: $45.4

New York: $51.8M

Pittsburgh: $52.5M

Tampa: $57.5

None of those teams should have a difficult time getting under the cap and all of them have far better teams signed for the 13/14 season.

For example, the Stanley Cup champions have more than $10M in cap space with 9 players to sign to fill out their roster.

Considering their core is locked up, they can afford to replace Simon Gagne, Penner and Scuderi with younger, cheaper options.

Remember they have a ton of gifted youngsters in Manchester.

Tampa will likely have to buy out a big ticket (Vinny?) but they too have a lot of young talent in Syracuse.

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#57 DSF
December 28 2012, 05:35PM
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victor wrote:

You should check his salary, not his cap hit. Unless you think he's entitled to an increase for hitting his bonuses?

PS: Magically trading Luongo and Raymond, and buying out Ballard isn't going to fix the Canucks. Sad, but Gillis really screwed them, should have moved Luongo before staring down the barrel of a $60m cap.

PPS: To the original posting by JW, wasn't it here that posters were commenting that you don't draft and develop 3rd liners? Who cares about the Pitlick's and Martindales, they're a dime-a-dozen, or so I've heard. Better to develop top 2 line talent, and top minutes players, and fill in with veterans. Isn't that right?

Cap hit is all that counts for this exercise.

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#58 cableguy - 2nd Tier Fan
December 28 2012, 05:38PM
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gazmort wrote:

DSF, I'm concerned. You seem to have forgotten that you yourself, mere days ago, were calling for an implosion of the league (re: disclaimer of interest) and a free agent frenzy culminating in an exodus of Oilers talent. How did this not come to pass!? Especially after you said it would.

you mean like this one?

DSF wrote:

The dispute is now before the courts.

This season is over.....

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#59 Sliderule
December 28 2012, 05:54PM
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If you take away the oilers on ok city didn't basically the same team go long in the playoffs last year. This AHL is on steroids as every team has two or more players that would be in the NHL. If the NHL starts up they will call up Rajala and give ice time to Cornet and some of the healthy scratches We might be surprised at how guys like Lander Pitlick and MPS respond to the opportunity .

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#60 DSF
December 28 2012, 05:57PM
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Ryan2 wrote:

@ DSF - "With Granlund, Coyle, Zucker, Larsson, Palmieri, Brodin and maybe Dumba ready to step in on cheap contracts, they'll be the opposite side of the coin to the Oilers."

You are kidding, right? Looks like Oilers' fans are not the only ones with rose colored glasses......

Brodin got hurt on an NHL speed play by a player not know for hitting and has played how many games this season in the AHL? So far, it has been a waste of half of a development year. He is better off staying there for the full year, getting healthy, and learning the more physical North American game at a slower speed. That being said, if the Wild would like to ruin one of their potential blue chip prospects, as an Oilers fan I say let them go right ahead and do it.

Dumba is not close to being NHL ready - heck, he could not crack the WJHC squad and who from that team could step right in? FWIW, I did not view him as a lock for the NHL when he was drafted due to his size and style of play and I have not seen anything to change that view yet. He can get away with it in the dub, but playing against bigger men that can skate is another story.

Granlund is possibly ready, but it still might benefit him more to play in the AHL for a year to get used to the different style of play and increased number of games. Paajarvi could have used that approach as well.......

Coyle = Paajarvi or Hartikainen as far as stats go in the AHL this year, and both are on the bubble as far as playing in the NHL this season for a weak team (although I would like to see both start off the season with the Oilers to see what happens).

Larsson - see above re: Granlund, but even less ready than him. He is not ready to play in the show.

Palmieri - may (finally) be ready this season, but if not, it might be time to move him as he was an 07 draft pick and is getting long in the tooth.........

This is all nonsense.

1) You think Klefbom (who has never played in NA) is in a better position than Brodin? And yet everyone is pencilling Klefbom in for next season?

2) Minnesota's defensive depth looks like this:

Suter-Gilbert Falk-Scandella Spurgeon-Brodin/Stoner/Cuma/Dumba

No need to rush anyone and there are no Peckhams or Potters in that bunch.

3) Granlund is so much better than Paajarvi he's in another area code. Thing is, Granlund will be playing centre behind Koivu with Cullen, Brodziak, Konopka and Torrey Mitchell (among others) for support. He'll be fine.

4) Jason Zucker: 13G 12A 25P

Hartikainen: 9G 11A 20P

Nick Palmieri: 9G 10A 19P

Paajarvi: 4G 15A 19P

Charlie Coyle: 11G 7A 18P

Johann Larsson: 6G 10A 16P

Palmieri is the same age as Gagner and is cheap. Why would you move him?

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#61 DSF
December 28 2012, 06:03PM
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cableguy - 2nd Tier Fan wrote:

you mean like this one?

DSF wrote:

The dispute is now before the courts.

This season is over.....

Gary blinked.

Get over it.

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#62 Oilertown
December 28 2012, 06:07PM
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DSF wrote:

This is all nonsense.

1) You think Klefbom (who has never played in NA) is in a better position than Brodin? And yet everyone is pencilling Klefbom in for next season?

2) Minnesota's defensive depth looks like this:

Suter-Gilbert Falk-Scandella Spurgeon-Brodin/Stoner/Cuma/Dumba

No need to rush anyone and there are no Peckhams or Potters in that bunch.

3) Granlund is so much better than Paajarvi he's in another area code. Thing is, Granlund will be playing centre behind Koivu with Cullen, Brodziak, Konopka and Torrey Mitchell (among others) for support. He'll be fine.

4) Jason Zucker: 13G 12A 25P

Hartikainen: 9G 11A 20P

Nick Palmieri: 9G 10A 19P

Paajarvi: 4G 15A 19P

Charlie Coyle: 11G 7A 18P

Johann Larsson: 6G 10A 16P

Palmieri is the same age as Gagner and is cheap. Why would you move him?

Geez if Palmieri has that kind of points in the A, what would Gags have?

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#63 DSF
December 28 2012, 06:08PM
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victor wrote:

You're assuming that the RFA provisions in the next CBA require a contract to exceed the cap hits. He's clearly an RFA for 2013-2014, so I assumed that he'd be willing to sign a longer term deal for a reduced cap hit.

PS: What's the Luongo deal that doesn't have the Canucks taking on cap?

I would expect some cap hit will come back but buying out Ballard and trading Raymond makes it pretty easy.

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#64 stevezie
December 28 2012, 06:12PM
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@DSF

Palmieri being as old as Gagner is a strike against him, non? He's putting up Pajarvi numbers and is older.

I do think you're right about Zucker- often overlooked prospect.

Anyone claiming to know who will be better between Brodin and Klefbom is a fool- they're young D so it's a close call at the best of times but with their respective injury history they're both nothing to write in ink anywhere. Brodin is the better bet at this time but it's close enough that no one should be talking tough.

Granlund is awesome, no reasonable person would deny this.

I don't know why you cut Coyle so much more slack than you seem willing ot give any Oiler prospect. His numbers are nice, but pretty far from amazing.

Unrelated note- What happened to Chris Kreider?

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#65 DSF
December 28 2012, 06:14PM
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Oilertown wrote:

Geez if Palmieri has that kind of points in the A, what would Gags have?

Good grief.

Palmieri was a third round pick.

Is that all you've got?

Paajarvi was a top ten pick and is being outscored by a third rounder.

That's embarrassing.

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#66 victor
December 28 2012, 06:15PM
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@DSF

1) You think Klefbom (who has never played in NA) is in a better position than Brodin? And yet everyone is pencilling Klefbom in for next season?

Brodin has played all of 8 games in the AHL. That's likely the difference on Craig Button's list of top 30 prospects. He has Klefbom at 18, and Brodin at 17.

For the vaunted Minnesota defensive depth, Suter and Gilbert will be a good pairing. For nearly 20% of the cap, they better be. As to the others, as you point out with Klefbom, you might want to wait to see if they're players.

PS: What's the Luongo deal that doesn't have Vancouver take on cap?

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#67 victor
December 28 2012, 06:15PM
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@DSF

1) You think Klefbom (who has never played in NA) is in a better position than Brodin? And yet everyone is pencilling Klefbom in for next season?

Brodin has played all of 8 games in the AHL. That's likely the difference on Craig Button's list of top 30 prospects. He has Klefbom at 18, and Brodin at 17.

For the vaunted Minnesota defensive depth, Suter and Gilbert will be a good pairing. For nearly 20% of the cap, they better be. As to the others, as you point out with Klefbom, you might want to wait to see if they're players.

PS: What's the Luongo deal that doesn't have Vancouver take on cap?

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#68 stevezie
December 28 2012, 06:20PM
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DSF wrote:

That is not what is on the table.

Cap hits will stay the same.

I don't understand why the owners of The Bostons and Vancouvers of the world have shown so little interest in protecting their current teams. Make whole is important, lowering the cap is important, but keeping proactive GMs from getting screwed over isn't a priority? If the cap drops but cap hits stay the same it is a middle finger to teams who bothered securing their core before the lockout. Maybe this is intentional.

I might be missing something; I'm not following the business side that closely.

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#69 DSF
December 28 2012, 06:22PM
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stevezie wrote:

Palmieri being as old as Gagner is a strike against him, non? He's putting up Pajarvi numbers and is older.

I do think you're right about Zucker- often overlooked prospect.

Anyone claiming to know who will be better between Brodin and Klefbom is a fool- they're young D so it's a close call at the best of times but with their respective injury history they're both nothing to write in ink anywhere. Brodin is the better bet at this time but it's close enough that no one should be talking tough.

Granlund is awesome, no reasonable person would deny this.

I don't know why you cut Coyle so much more slack than you seem willing ot give any Oiler prospect. His numbers are nice, but pretty far from amazing.

Unrelated note- What happened to Chris Kreider?

As noted, Palmieri was a third round pick and nothing more than a depth player.

The Brodin-Klefbom debate is certainly up in the air since both are injured but as I noted earlier, Klefbom is the best Oiler D prospect and everyone is counting on him being a top 4 defenseman yesterday.

Brodin doesn't face that kind of pressure because Minny already has a rock solid top 4.

I expect, though they will have very similar careers.

Coyle is an interesting prospect because he has played in 3 different leagues in the last 12 months.

He's also a 6'2" 210 winger who is putting up decent numbers in the AHL.

What's not to like?

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#70 DSF
December 28 2012, 06:24PM
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stevezie wrote:

I don't understand why the owners of The Bostons and Vancouvers of the world have shown so little interest in protecting their current teams. Make whole is important, lowering the cap is important, but keeping proactive GMs from getting screwed over isn't a priority? If the cap drops but cap hits stay the same it is a middle finger to teams who bothered securing their core before the lockout. Maybe this is intentional.

I might be missing something; I'm not following the business side that closely.

It appears that Bettman is intent on punishing those GM's who abused the "spirit" of the last CBA.

That Jeremy Jacobs is one of the hawks is very curious.

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#71 Johe
December 28 2012, 06:26PM
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Maybe I can put all of this Oiler cap trouble talk to rest: the Oilers have three players signed past next year. THREE! And Horcoff is one of them, and DSF assures us he will be bought out. So for the 2014-2015 season we have two players signed. I think the Oilers will be fine.

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#72 DSF
December 28 2012, 06:27PM
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victor wrote:

1) You think Klefbom (who has never played in NA) is in a better position than Brodin? And yet everyone is pencilling Klefbom in for next season?

Brodin has played all of 8 games in the AHL. That's likely the difference on Craig Button's list of top 30 prospects. He has Klefbom at 18, and Brodin at 17.

For the vaunted Minnesota defensive depth, Suter and Gilbert will be a good pairing. For nearly 20% of the cap, they better be. As to the others, as you point out with Klefbom, you might want to wait to see if they're players.

PS: What's the Luongo deal that doesn't have Vancouver take on cap?

I think Brodin and Klefbom are likely as close as Button says they are.

But, as noted, Brodin doesn't have to step in and be a top 4 defenseman right away. Minny has better depth.

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#73 victor
December 28 2012, 06:29PM
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DSF wrote:

As noted, Palmieri was a third round pick and nothing more than a depth player.

The Brodin-Klefbom debate is certainly up in the air since both are injured but as I noted earlier, Klefbom is the best Oiler D prospect and everyone is counting on him being a top 4 defenseman yesterday.

Brodin doesn't face that kind of pressure because Minny already has a rock solid top 4.

I expect, though they will have very similar careers.

Coyle is an interesting prospect because he has played in 3 different leagues in the last 12 months.

He's also a 6'2" 210 winger who is putting up decent numbers in the AHL.

What's not to like?

In 2012-2013, when the cap hit becomes an issue, they'll have Suter@7.538, Gilbert@4, Scandella, Faulk, and Spurgeon as RFA's. Only Clayton Stoner has a good contract, but he (like Gilbert) will be a UFA at the end of that year. But, hey, Brodin might get into another game this year, right, so he won't be a rookie technically?

PS: Specifically, what's the deal with Luongo going to be? Luongo and a high pick for a lower pick and a cap dump. Jeez, Gillis is such a great GM.

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#75 Johe
December 28 2012, 06:41PM
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@DSF

Are you really defending the defensive depth of the Wild? They have a top end #1 in Suter, a #3 in Gilbert, and then...

And please don't bring up the Oilers defensive depth if you reply to this. Everyone knows it's lacking- that has been discussed ad nauseum. We're talking the Wild here, and there's no way you can honestly say they have anything resembling depth or a "rock solid top 4." Yes, Suter is very good, but he can't play left and right d at the same time for 60 minutes a night.

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#76 DSF
December 28 2012, 06:43PM
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victor wrote:

In 2012-2013, when the cap hit becomes an issue, they'll have Suter@7.538, Gilbert@4, Scandella, Faulk, and Spurgeon as RFA's. Only Clayton Stoner has a good contract, but he (like Gilbert) will be a UFA at the end of that year. But, hey, Brodin might get into another game this year, right, so he won't be a rookie technically?

PS: Specifically, what's the deal with Luongo going to be? Luongo and a high pick for a lower pick and a cap dump. Jeez, Gillis is such a great GM.

Are you drunk?

You know this is 2012/13, right?

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#77 Oiler Al
December 28 2012, 06:44PM
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Where's the answer? Maybe Stu MacGregor isn't the "shining star" people think he is? [lever mind the lotto picks, and Schultz].

Its no secret that Hamilton is a major bust, and Pitlick might not be far off that same pace.

The light might still be on in Paajarvi's house , but it is not shinning to brightly the last couple of seasons.This is the biggest mystery or letdown . Has skil, size and speed...! He as played most of is American hockey with pluggers though... might to need to play with skill guys.?

Take away Schultz, and there's not much on the D at this point, but usually take more time to develop.

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#78 DSF
December 28 2012, 06:47PM
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Johe wrote:

Are you really defending the defensive depth of the Wild? They have a top end #1 in Suter, a #3 in Gilbert, and then...

And please don't bring up the Oilers defensive depth if you reply to this. Everyone knows it's lacking- that has been discussed ad nauseum. We're talking the Wild here, and there's no way you can honestly say they have anything resembling depth or a "rock solid top 4." Yes, Suter is very good, but he can't play left and right d at the same time for 60 minutes a night.

Yes I am.

Scandella, Falk, Spurgeon, Brodin and Dumba is a very nice group.

With Suter and Gilbert playing huge minutes, they'll be fine.

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#79 victor
December 28 2012, 06:47PM
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DSF wrote:

Are you drunk?

You know this is 2012/13, right?

Sorry, I meant 2013-2014. But you knew that, and yet again, didn't answer the question. So, while composing another response, I'll ask again:

What specifically do you think the magical Luongo deal will be? Please enlighten us as to the return you expect, be them players or picks. I'll wait patiently....

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#80 DSF
December 28 2012, 06:48PM
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Johe wrote:

Maybe I can put all of this Oiler cap trouble talk to rest: the Oilers have three players signed past next year. THREE! And Horcoff is one of them, and DSF assures us he will be bought out. So for the 2014-2015 season we have two players signed. I think the Oilers will be fine.

So those Hall and Eberle 6 year contracts are a mirage?

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#81 DSF
December 28 2012, 06:52PM
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victor wrote:

Sorry, I meant 2013-2014. But you knew that, and yet again, didn't answer the question. So, while composing another response, I'll ask again:

What specifically do you think the magical Luongo deal will be? Please enlighten us as to the return you expect, be them players or picks. I'll wait patiently....

There are apparently two teams in the running.

Toronto and Edmonton.

If it's Toronto, I expect Burke will give up Kadri and a young defenseman.

If it's Edmonton, I would expect a multi player trade with Hemsky and a prospect going the other way for Luongo and Raymond.

All speculation of course.

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#82 Oilertown
December 28 2012, 06:56PM
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DSF wrote:

Good grief.

Palmieri was a third round pick.

Is that all you've got?

Paajarvi was a top ten pick and is being outscored by a third rounder.

That's embarrassing.

So you admit Gagner is a good player, certainly worthy of 1st round status.

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#83 victor
December 28 2012, 06:56PM
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@DSF

You've clearly pointed out, earlier in the thread, why Edmonton can't take on any more cap, so they're clearly out of the running.

Kadri, a player like Max Everson, and a cap dump (or agreeing to take on cap space, as permitted in the new CBA) from TO?

Yep, sounds like Gillis is maximizing his opportunities.

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#84 Johe
December 28 2012, 07:00PM
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DSF wrote:

So those Hall and Eberle 6 year contracts are a mirage?

Um, no. Those are the two players signed past next year.

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#85 The Oilers Shot Clock
December 28 2012, 07:02PM
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Yes the Oilers might have to move one of the first'ers. How is this news people?...Its not even that bad of a situation. The market will/should be saturated and it will be a buyers market. A young kid like Yakupov still in his entry deal will have optimum value in a such a market. We cant expect to keep them all and sooner or later, real hockey moves will have to be made. Not the end of the world.Not the beginning of the end. Not even a negative.

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#86 Johe
December 28 2012, 07:02PM
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Plus Yakupov. My bad. So the Oilers have three players signed past next year(and Horcoff).

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#87 DSF
December 28 2012, 07:04PM
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Johe wrote:

Um, no. Those are the two players signed past next year.

Klefbom, Musil, Pitlick, and a bunch of junk are also signed beyond that.

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#88 DSF
December 28 2012, 07:06PM
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Oilertown wrote:

So you admit Gagner is a good player, certainly worthy of 1st round status.

No. I admit he's better than a third round pick. Although PK Subban is clearly a better player from that draft as are a dozen other players.

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#89 DSF
December 28 2012, 07:08PM
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victor wrote:

You've clearly pointed out, earlier in the thread, why Edmonton can't take on any more cap, so they're clearly out of the running.

Kadri, a player like Max Everson, and a cap dump (or agreeing to take on cap space, as permitted in the new CBA) from TO?

Yep, sounds like Gillis is maximizing his opportunities.

Hemsky out and Luongo is is pretty much a wash.

Both teams get better.

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#90 victor
December 28 2012, 07:13PM
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DSF wrote:

Hemsky out and Luongo is is pretty much a wash.

Both teams get better.

Hemsky's deal is only two years, and was structured to pay players like Hopkins.

If Luongo's deal wasn't until 2022, it would be closer. Hey, if they sign the deal now, perhaps his deal might end before the next lockout.

Nah, never happen ;-)

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#91 Johe
December 28 2012, 07:19PM
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DSF wrote:

Yes I am.

Scandella, Falk, Spurgeon, Brodin and Dumba is a very nice group.

With Suter and Gilbert playing huge minutes, they'll be fine.

Let us take a closer look at this "very nice group."

Marco Scandella: 83 NHL games: 3 goals 11 assists -31 rating

Justin Falk: 72 NHL games: 1 goal 11 assists -20 rating

Jared Spurgeon: 123 NHL games: 7 goals 28 assists -5 rating

Jonas Brodin: At least a year away.

Matt Dumba: Probably 3 years away.

And having Gilbert play huge minutes is not really a positive. Good player, but not good enough to play huge minutes. Certainly if he was playing for the Oilers you would admit as much.

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#92 Johe
December 28 2012, 07:25PM
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DSF wrote:

Klefbom, Musil, Pitlick, and a bunch of junk are also signed beyond that.

Well "junk" doesn't get to be on the NHL roster so my point stands: three players are signed past next year.

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#93 Oilertown
December 28 2012, 07:34PM
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DSF you have got my goat again. Congratulations I can't argue with stupid.

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#94 DSF
December 28 2012, 07:45PM
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Oilertown wrote:

DSF you have got my goat again. Congratulations I can't argue with stupid.

Sure you can.

Look in the mirror.

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#95 DSF
December 28 2012, 07:46PM
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Johe wrote:

Well "junk" doesn't get to be on the NHL roster so my point stands: three players are signed past next year.

Well that's encouraging.

Most teams have their core players locked up long term.

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#96 Johe
December 28 2012, 07:50PM
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DSF wrote:

Well that's encouraging.

Most teams have their core players locked up long term.

Ugh- you just keep spinning this whatever way you can. I'm pointing out that the Oilers have cap flexibility. You were saying they didn't. And obviously the Oilers will sign players like Smid, RNH, and possibly Yakupov to long term deals. Oh, and that guy that will never sign with them in the first place. You know, the rookie defenseman leading the AHL in scoring.

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#97 Oilertown
December 28 2012, 07:56PM
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DSF wrote:

Sure you can.

Look in the mirror.

No actually I can't and you pass that barometer time and time again every day actually.

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#98 Robin Brownlee
December 28 2012, 08:25PM
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@Jonathan Willis

You're reaching.

The Barons went into play tonight six points back of the top team in the AHL. That sounds as good as "one game over .500" does bad, right? Same team.

Add . . . . What players did other teams add? And, like I said (and you ignored) Hall and RNH haven't played close to a full slate of games.

Again, how many more points should the Barons have to meet expectations? Is anything less than leading the entire AHL "struggling?"

No sale.

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#99 Bank Shot
December 28 2012, 08:47PM
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Johe wrote:

Let us take a closer look at this "very nice group."

Marco Scandella: 83 NHL games: 3 goals 11 assists -31 rating

Justin Falk: 72 NHL games: 1 goal 11 assists -20 rating

Jared Spurgeon: 123 NHL games: 7 goals 28 assists -5 rating

Jonas Brodin: At least a year away.

Matt Dumba: Probably 3 years away.

And having Gilbert play huge minutes is not really a positive. Good player, but not good enough to play huge minutes. Certainly if he was playing for the Oilers you would admit as much.

Basically 3 sophmore defensemen, and a couple of rookies in the top seven. That doesn't cut it at the NHL level.

I'm not sure why you guys bother getting drug into arguements with DSF when he is obviously just trying to get a rise out of you.

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#100 Oilertown
December 28 2012, 09:06PM
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Bank Shot wrote:

Basically 3 sophmore defensemen, and a couple of rookies in the top seven. That doesn't cut it at the NHL level.

I'm not sure why you guys bother getting drug into arguements with DSF when he is obviously just trying to get a rise out of you.

I know hey, he talks out his ass and then we all argue with him lol.

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