Great Expectations

Jonathan Willis
July 01 2013 11:29AM

There has been some significant backlash from Edmonton Oilers fans, both here and elsewhere, following a draft that fell somewhat short of Craig MacTavish’s lofty goals going in. How much is justified?

Pre-Draft

When MacTavish was introduced as the new general manager of the Oilers, there was mixed reaction, which makes sense given his long history with Edmonton’s fans and the animosity many felt during his time as coach. He did say all the right things, though, and implicitly contrasted himself to predecessor Steve Tambellini with comments like this one:

I’m an impatient guy, and I bring that impatience to this situation. I think that we’re at the stage in terms of the cycle of our hockey club right now that we have to do some bold things. We have to expose ourselves to some semblance of risk to try and move the team forward in a rapid fashion. My sense, and my analysis from watching the team over the last number of months is much the same as a lot of people’s analysis of our team. We need greater depth, we’ve got a lot of great primary pieces.

Asked if there could be as many as eight new Oilers, MacTavish said, “I think that’s fair. There’s going to be some significant and meaningful change for sure.”

Comments in that vein all down the line, combined with media- (and, yes, blog-)driven hype and rumours served to push expectations sky high. Lots of players were available for the right offer. The Oilers were linked all over, to goalies and forwards and defencemen, and the feeling going in was that the Oilers would come out of the draft looking substantially different than when they entered it.

Dud

In the larger picture, it’s worth noting that such hype was particularly strong in Edmonton, but it wasn’t confined to the Oilers; lots of teams hoped to be able to do something at the draft. But in the grand scheme of things, the draft was a dud. Cory Schneider went to New Jersey for a fraction of the cost Vancouver would have charged Edmonton. Cal Clutterbuck went to Brooklyn at the cost of former fifth overall pick Nino Niederreiter. Andrej Sekera cost both a pretty good defenceman (Jamie McBain) and the 35th overall pick.

The best, and perhaps only, bargain of the day was likely San Jose’s acquisition of Tyler Kennedy for a second round draft pick.

Should the Oilers have given Vancouver their asking price for Schneider – reportedly the 7th overall, a second round pick and a young NHL-ready player? Should they have swapped Magnus Paajarvi for Cal Clutterbuck? I’d answer an emphatic ‘no’ to both, and that’s just how it is: the trade prices were too high to get anything done.

So, while superficially the draft was a dud, in this case “dud” was likely better than the alternative.

Reality

Unfortunately, this leaves Craig MacTavish in virtually the same place he entered the draft: in need of making significant changes to his hockey team. The defence and the bottom six needs to be overhauled. Players like Ales Hemsky and Shawn Horcoff are still on the team; if Craig MacTavish has prioritized moving them than they still need to go (though at this point, it is fair to wonder if the Oilers really are best-served by moving them). The same is true in net, where Devan Dubnyk offers Edmonton a perfectly serviceable number one goalie in the prime of his career; the Oilers appear to want an elite goaltender and if that’s a priority for them they will need to find it somewhere else. The big left winger the team covets still needs to be found as well.

There is time to do these things, but the draft was expected to be a significant opportunity, and it is definitely a bad thing for the team that the opportunity turned out to be only a mirage. The next big step is free agency, and the post-free agency trades for teams that didn’t land their preferred targets. The Oilers can’t afford to go through those periods without making significant changes.

Recently around the Nation Network

The Oilers draft may have been quiet, but the Calgary Flames' certainly was not. The decision to pass on Hunter Shinkaruk and instead pick Emile Poirier was widely critiqued, but the Flames' 67th overall pick drew some negative attention, too:

After round 1, there isn't much to talk about. Feaster failed to nab any other early-to-mid picks so it's even more baffling that the organization decided to use their lone choice between 30-100 on man mountain Keegan Kanzig. The 6'7", 240+ pound defender, by all accounts, is a guy who can't really skate, can't handle the puck and has no offense to speak of. He was ranked in the 190's amongst North American skaters by Central Scouting. Corey Pronman didn't rank him in the top-100 either.

Click the link to read more, or alternately, feel free check out some of my other pieces here:

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Jonathan Willis is a freelance writer. He currently works for Oilers Nation, the Edmonton Journal and Bleacher Report. He's co-written three books and worked for myriad websites, including Grantland, ESPN, The Score, and Hockey Prospectus. He was previously the founder and managing editor of Copper & Blue.
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#51 nuge2nail
July 01 2013, 02:55PM
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Oiler Domination To Follow

I'm stunned at the stupidity of these posts. Simple.

Schneider > Nurse + Musil + Yakimov

Clutterbuck > Paarajvi

In what world is an elite goalie not better than a future top 4 defensive project.

Some fans here are unbelievable.

No Schneider is not overrated and yes he's worth #7 plus a second plus a prospect.

Plug a hole and move onto the next one. I think some fans are addicted to the infini-build and drafting players that will help the oilers in 2016.

Wake up- we need to win NOW. Our team is a joke, and players are getting too used losing

God I hope we sign Jagr to change some of the culture here.

Fans, players, management, coaches are all too used to losing.

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#52 DSF
July 01 2013, 02:55PM
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madjam wrote:

DSF : Not sure what you mean by Bullets . I'd say we have maybe 9 caliber long range bullets and a few short caliber bullets (veterans in declining mode ) . Small crop of developing pellets and an overload of BB's . Not too many poly core slugs but an abundance of bird shot . Suggest we use quantity to procure more quality , and keep the bullets and quickly developing pellets . Softer bullets can be made available for upgrades even if more than one required to get a good one .

Horcoff - negative value

Hemsky - negative value (might get a draft pick if you keep half his salary)

Smyth - zero value

Gagner - unsigned

Paajarvi - unsigned (would only be worth a roster player in a package)

Belanger (interesting that he hasn't been bought out tick tock)

Peckham - zero value

The Oilers can't afford to trade any defensemen currently on the roster so any trades they make will have to involve prospects who have some value.

Lander

Rajala

Pitlick

Klefbom

Marincin

Musil

Gernat

Unless a GM is dumping salary at this time of the year, they will be wanting to trade for players who can help them in the upcoming season.

Do you see any of those?

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#53 DSF
July 01 2013, 02:59PM
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Mike Krushelnyski wrote:

Totally agree. I mean if MacT hasn't done anything to improve the team by now when it's already several hours into July, what are the odds he's going to have any sort of competitive team on the ice by October?

Generally speaking, the NHL transaction activity goes dark about a week after free agency as management take a vacation and then gears up for the coming season.

While I am sure there have been the occasional exceptions, MacT likely has less than two weeks to rebuild his roster.

We'll see.

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#54 nuge2nail
July 01 2013, 02:59PM
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Oiler Domination To Follow

We need a top six winger with size, a new bottom six, a top 4 d, an a #1 goalie.

None of the problems plaguing the oilers for the last 7 years was addressed.

You people can really blame some of us fans who are upset about that.

Give me a break.

One trade In seven years that might be a positive for us.

Penner(30 goal scorer at the time) for a 17th overall pick. That's it.

How can a "team" of experts, a complete management team do so little with so much time.

You could pick up a random fan at a bar who could manage this team better.

Hope I'm wrong, but being wrong would mean we overpay at free agency.

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#55 nuge2nail
July 01 2013, 03:24PM
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Oiler Domination To Follow

Please sign Ference and Jagr and lets hope for the best.

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#56 WhattaMike
July 01 2013, 03:24PM
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Man O Man!!!! The Oilers are not far from the playoffs when considering what has to be done with geting the bottom six revamped, a goalie and a top LW...

The farm system was correctly replenished a bit yesterday with the exception of a goalie prospect basically.

The Oilers...if anyone does properly remember...were right at the 6 seed for the p-layoffs until...only...that wretched nine game winless streak of which was in connection to that horrific nine game road trip.

If anyone wants to compare the Oilers to the Islanders such as in the Islanders now have a great young team, I would do so in a heartbeatas I know the Oilers have better young talent, especially with whats coming up for the defence core in the next two yrs.

It was the GM last year (Tamby), the type of coaching, the inexperience of the kids, the many injuries, and also...the very bad veteran mentality (aka Belanger, Eager, Jones, Petrell, Smyth, Whitney, etc, even Horcoff and Hemsky) combined...that actually costed the Oilers a trip to the playoffs this past season.

Not the lack of core talent!!!!!

When ya got sulking players on top of injuries such as Whitney, Horcoff, Hemsky...cause they are being downgraded for the kids who actually are much better, aggressive and durable..along with poor coaching..then the end turned will always turn bad...

I want to see what MacT can do in the next ten weeks not one day and I want to see what Eakins and Acton do to get rid of the crap and type coach system that was played all season...before jumping onto the complainers wagon...

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#57 madjam
July 01 2013, 03:24PM
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DSF: In your first grouping . Timing off for a return on Horcoff and Hemsky as they will net us a bottom 6 player minimum ,maybe even top 9 for Hemsky if we wait for trade deadline . At that time the subsequent year would get good value for Horcoff . Value goes up instead of being so far down now . Paajarvi's worth should also multiply by having him one more year .Doesn't sound like Gagner is for sale . The rest might get us if packaged a good fourth liner .

Second Group: Bottom four keep for now : Top 3 should get us a reasonable player or two even if needed to be packaged . Two would be a stretch , however even with Jones in there .

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#58 Next up, is Connor McJesus.
July 01 2013, 03:25PM
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Rama Lama wrote:

Yes he was there, one reporter heard him talking to another GM and he was telling him about his " six Stanley Cup Rings" and how he was a champion once. Then the other GM told him '" yea that was a million years ago and now people think you are a loser".

There was a little swearing, and a few fist flying, and then security was called followed by paramedics as one of Kevins Lowes Stanley cup rings was embedded in the other GM's forehead.

Now according to sources he only has five Stanley Cup Rings.

lmao

When MacKinnon cornered him, he responded with that 6 rings, I think I know a little bit about building a winning hockey club. This statement alone must tell us he's still very much in charge of this hockey club, and at of all places, MacTavishs' introduction as the new GM's press conference.

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#59 fig pucker
July 01 2013, 03:32PM
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to all of these people who feel we need a goaltending upgrade, ask your self this, how well would, quick, rene, rask or any number of top nhl net minders play with the oilers defence in front of them? i would suggest not much if at all better. no team can be successful if the goalie has to stand on his head every night just to give you a fighting chance, regardless of who that goalie is. let's get a real nhl defencive squad playing a real defensive systm, then we'll know what we really have with dubnyck.

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#60 DSF
July 01 2013, 03:38PM
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madjam wrote:

DSF: In your first grouping . Timing off for a return on Horcoff and Hemsky as they will net us a bottom 6 player minimum ,maybe even top 9 for Hemsky if we wait for trade deadline . At that time the subsequent year would get good value for Horcoff . Value goes up instead of being so far down now . Paajarvi's worth should also multiply by having him one more year .Doesn't sound like Gagner is for sale . The rest might get us if packaged a good fourth liner .

Second Group: Bottom four keep for now : Top 3 should get us a reasonable player or two even if needed to be packaged . Two would be a stretch , however even with Jones in there .

1) Horcoff's value will never go up, never. He's turning 35 in a few weeks and his production at all facets of the game has fallen off a cliff.

2) Hemsky might get you some excess baggage at the deadline but at that time of the year, teams are looking to ADD good players not subtract them. There's also a pretty good chance Hemsky will be injured then so will be untradeable.

3) We really don't know what Paajarvi's value will be a year from now or what his cap hit will be and the team needs help NOW, not a year from now.

4) Yes it seems likely the Oilers will have no choice but to sign Gagner and the Oilers have handled it so badly that Gagner has ALL the leverage.

If the Oilers go into the season with Lander or Horcoff as their top centre, the season will be over by the end of October.

5) If you are unwilling to trade any of your decent prospects you won't get anything in return.

The last best hope for MacT, since he has close to zero tradeable assets is to strike it rich in free agency which is the absolute worst time to try adding players since you almost always have to overpay.

With Hopkins unlikely ready to start the season, MacT has an urgent need at centre.

He has to try and rebuild his bottom 6 with UFA players.

He needs at least 1 top 4 D.

And he has to find a #2G and #3G.

Tick tock.

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#61 Next up, is Connor McJesus.
July 01 2013, 03:42PM
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nuge2nail wrote:

Oiler Domination To Follow

I'm stunned at the stupidity of these posts. Simple.

Schneider > Nurse + Musil + Yakimov

Clutterbuck > Paarajvi

In what world is an elite goalie not better than a future top 4 defensive project.

Some fans here are unbelievable.

No Schneider is not overrated and yes he's worth #7 plus a second plus a prospect.

Plug a hole and move onto the next one. I think some fans are addicted to the infini-build and drafting players that will help the oilers in 2016.

Wake up- we need to win NOW. Our team is a joke, and players are getting too used losing

God I hope we sign Jagr to change some of the culture here.

Fans, players, management, coaches are all too used to losing.

Well that, sure went downhill fast....

By the jist of your post, this whole "Oiler Domination to follow" thing you have going on there. Is that some holdover thing from the 80's? Or, just some slogan that doesn't need to be at all accurate/applicable about the current hockey team.

Are you guilty of partaking in too many Canada Day celebrations perhaps?

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#62 Eddie Shore
July 01 2013, 03:58PM
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Matheson saying MacT offered Pitlick and a 2nd for Clutterbuck. Hard to fault him because Minny took the Isles offer over that. I don't think Clutterbuck is worth more than that.

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#63 Lochenzo
July 01 2013, 04:01PM
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Fine line between being bold and being reckless. MacT avoided being reckless.

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#64 nuge2nail
July 01 2013, 04:09PM
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fig pucker wrote:

to all of these people who feel we need a goaltending upgrade, ask your self this, how well would, quick, rene, rask or any number of top nhl net minders play with the oilers defence in front of them? i would suggest not much if at all better. no team can be successful if the goalie has to stand on his head every night just to give you a fighting chance, regardless of who that goalie is. let's get a real nhl defencive squad playing a real defensive systm, then we'll know what we really have with dubnyck.

Oiler Domination To Follow

Good goalies need good defensive systems and great Defenceman to be good.

Great goalies need good defenseman to be great.

Elite goalies make good defenseman look great and steal games for their teams on the regular. An elite goalie makes the entire team play with confidence and swagger.

I believe we need an Elite goalie and we currently have a good goalie.

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#65 Freewheeling Freddie
July 01 2013, 04:10PM
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Wow people want Mact to be a magician. Nothing happened at the draft for big Oiler trades. Friday will be a completely different story. However goaltending is a major problem throughout the organization .we need help at all levels.Down the middle is where I get real nervous.Still 3 months to go .

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#66 nuge2nail
July 01 2013, 04:17PM
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Next up, is Connor McJesus. wrote:

Well that, sure went downhill fast....

By the jist of your post, this whole "Oiler Domination to follow" thing you have going on there. Is that some holdover thing from the 80's? Or, just some slogan that doesn't need to be at all accurate/applicable about the current hockey team.

Are you guilty of partaking in too many Canada Day celebrations perhaps?

Oiler Domination To Follow

It was something I believed when I started posting here three years ago.

Now it's something I'm holding on to, in hopes the team will fill the obvious holes.

Top six lw with size(to compliment the smaller center(Sam))

Bottom six forwards(I was hoping for Clutterbuck, smith, stafford)

Top 4 D (Coburn - now i guess ill settle for Ference)

Elite Goalie (Emery or Hiller type will do)

Who knows maybe MacT will address all these holes, and Oiler Domination Follows... I am sad to say my hope is starting to fade for the first time in my life.... Now I just hope I'm wrong...

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#67 TDSM31
July 01 2013, 04:25PM
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** wrote:

The way I see it, Mac T, while not swinging the ball out of the park, did move forward on his plan by draft day:

-He signed Anton Belov, the best defender in the KHL, he beat other teams to it. You win some you lose some,we know of a couple of deals that didn't work, but this one he got.

-He got picks back that were wasted by tambellini on Jerred Smithson and Fistric. Wasted because they did not help the team move forward and cost part of the future. In this regard Mac T did a great job by multiplying his number of pics without giving up any assets. At the end of the day after the first round the chances guys make an impact drop significantly. So trading down for more picks is reasonable as it increases the odds of getting someone who pans out.

-He got the coaching staff ready by draft day, which he said would be the ideal situation. And it is a good looking coaching staff too.

-He decided to pick Darnell Nurse, a kind of player the Oilers desperately need, big, mean, and with a never quit attitude. He'll be a great piece of the Oilers in the not too distant future.

-He avoided making an emotional trade, which could have cost him dearly. The price for Schneider was ridiculous and in the end Mike Gillis got absolutely swindled by the New Jersey GM.

The bottom line for me is that Mac T looks like he is working really hard to improve the team be he is being smart about it and he is not jumping into bad deals. Tambellini looked like he was always just surveying the waters but not really jumping down and swim. And the few moves he did make that he thought were cheap and safe ended up being costly.

100% correct on all counts...

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#68 DSF
July 01 2013, 04:26PM
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Lochenzo wrote:

Fine line between being bold and being reckless. MacT avoided being reckless.

There's also a fine line between risk aversion and paralysis.

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#69 nuge2nail
July 01 2013, 04:27PM
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Lochenzo wrote:

Fine line between being bold and being reckless. MacT avoided being reckless.

Oiler Domination To Follow

I disagree. I think it's time to be reckless.

7 years of trading players for picks, trading players for prospects. Players like Sam Gagner have suffered long enough- get them some legit support. Chicago overpaid for Cambpell and Hossa around this time in their rebuild, that recklessness brought them a Stanley Cup.

Team should have sent a message to the young guys and traded some picks an prospects for useful players. The time to win is now, time to take risk and be reckless and I'm frustrated at the lack of movement.

Trade away the 2014 first rounder, package some prospects, take on some salary. We haven't seen a trade that's shown us any type of benefit in almost a decade. Isn't that what a GM is paid to do? If you just draft the bpa available every year - the head scout can do the job.

Take the Jays model, stack up on prospects and then trade them in packages deals for stars. Oilersnation has suffered long enough, time to reward us loyal fans with some bold moves. Time to reward the young players with a culture change(Jagr).

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#70 DSF
July 01 2013, 04:31PM
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Eddie Shore wrote:

Matheson saying MacT offered Pitlick and a 2nd for Clutterbuck. Hard to fault him because Minny took the Isles offer over that. I don't think Clutterbuck is worth more than that.

Pitlick has almost zero value as a replacement for an actual NHL player.

He scored 3 goals and 7 assists in the AHL last season.

Nino scored 28 goals and 22 assists.

Clutterbuck is WORTH exactly what someone was willing to pay for him.

If MacT thinks he can procure actual NHL players in return for his junk on the farm, he's really going to need an attitude adjustment.

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#71 Dave
July 01 2013, 04:33PM
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Why do the Oilers remind me of Blackberry at this point in time ?

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#72 cableguy - 2nd Tier Fan
July 01 2013, 04:33PM
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DSF wrote:

There's also a fine line between risk aversion and paralysis.

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#73 Eddie Shore
July 01 2013, 05:06PM
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@DSF

What/who would the great DSF have traded to land Clutterbuck? Please, enlighten me.

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#74 Tileguy
July 01 2013, 05:10PM
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MacT avoided overpaying with talent at the draft, goon on ya, on Friday it will be just fine to overpay with Katz,s money. go get me Mac

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#75 djc
July 01 2013, 05:18PM
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DSF wrote:

Pitlick has almost zero value as a replacement for an actual NHL player.

He scored 3 goals and 7 assists in the AHL last season.

Nino scored 28 goals and 22 assists.

Clutterbuck is WORTH exactly what someone was willing to pay for him.

If MacT thinks he can procure actual NHL players in return for his junk on the farm, he's really going to need an attitude adjustment.

Did you buy your Florida Drouin jersey yet old man?

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#76 bumboclate
July 01 2013, 05:24PM
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@nuge2nail

Your lost. Schneider is not worth that much. Imo mact wasnt a sucker! Schneider numbers are boosted by a defence in van. If dooby was playing van behind that D he would look better or just as good!

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#77 Next up, is Connor McJesus.
July 01 2013, 05:39PM
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Eddie Shore wrote:

Matheson saying MacT offered Pitlick and a 2nd for Clutterbuck. Hard to fault him because Minny took the Isles offer over that. I don't think Clutterbuck is worth more than that.

Might have be another one of those deals where Minnesota just didn't want him to go to another western conference opponent.

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#78 nuge2nail
July 01 2013, 05:39PM
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bumboclate wrote:

Your lost. Schneider is not worth that much. Imo mact wasnt a sucker! Schneider numbers are boosted by a defence in van. If dooby was playing van behind that D he would look better or just as good!

Oiler Domination To Follow

This team is lost, wandering in a dessert with no end in sight.

Your lost. Schneider will be a Vezina Candidate a few times in his career. I'm sure you will say it's the defensive system in NJ causing him to have such great stats. Schneider has won every where he has gone, Luongos play didn't cause the goaltending controversy- Schneiders amazing steady reliable play did. The worst save percentage he has ever had was .927, do you even know what that means? Go read some Luongo quotes on Schneider, an than go have a twitter war with him about how good Schneider will end up.

Franchise goalies are worth more than a draft pick between 7-9.

Make yourself feel better by believing this team is getting better. We have the same holes we've had since peca, rolosan, and Pronger left.

Tick, Tock.

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#79 rickithebear
July 01 2013, 05:40PM
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Hall-XXX-Gagner XXX-RNH-Eberle MP-XXX-Yakupov Smyth-XXX-Rajala

MacT said Arcabello performed better than RNH in the AHL. He was disappointed He did not get a better look at end of season. MacT drafted the second best NHL ready Dman. What forward still available slots on this team?

Then he dumps #37 and results in 5 picks Yakimov Slepyshev Houck Platzer Muir

Yakipov, Slepyshev, Yakimov all products of the same regional hockey school run by yakipov's dad.

yakipov's family moves to edmnton. MacT said he recieved inside info the two leading scorers for russia's 11-12 U18 want to come to NHL in 14-15 season.

18 year old production in KHL/RSL Kuznetsov .73 PPG Malkin .59 PPG Slepyshev .55 PPG Tarasenko .53 PPG Ovechkin .44 PPG Kulemin .41 PPG Semin .37 PPG

Yakimov russias last cut for u20 WJHC @ 18

Now but not at the expense of the future.

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#80 albertabeef
July 01 2013, 05:42PM
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nuge2nail wrote:

Oiler Domination To Follow

I'm stunned at the stupidity of these posts. Simple.

Schneider > Nurse + Musil + Yakimov

Clutterbuck > Paarajvi

In what world is an elite goalie not better than a future top 4 defensive project.

Some fans here are unbelievable.

No Schneider is not overrated and yes he's worth #7 plus a second plus a prospect.

Plug a hole and move onto the next one. I think some fans are addicted to the infini-build and drafting players that will help the oilers in 2016.

Wake up- we need to win NOW. Our team is a joke, and players are getting too used losing

God I hope we sign Jagr to change some of the culture here.

Fans, players, management, coaches are all too used to losing.

How old are you? This sounds like a rant from an impatient, impertinent kid. Ya think you are going to get a Stanely cup in one draft? Give MacT a year - see what he does. You want Jagr? Yeah, thasts what we need - an over the hill Diva.... Sheesh....

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#81 Colin
July 01 2013, 05:43PM
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nuge2nail wrote:

Oiler Domination To Follow

I'm stunned at the stupidity of these posts. Simple.

Schneider > Nurse + Musil + Yakimov

Clutterbuck > Paarajvi

In what world is an elite goalie not better than a future top 4 defensive project.

Some fans here are unbelievable.

No Schneider is not overrated and yes he's worth #7 plus a second plus a prospect.

Plug a hole and move onto the next one. I think some fans are addicted to the infini-build and drafting players that will help the oilers in 2016.

Wake up- we need to win NOW. Our team is a joke, and players are getting too used losing

God I hope we sign Jagr to change some of the culture here.

Fans, players, management, coaches are all too used to losing.

NO!!! Schneider is NOT worth what Vancouver asked edmonton for. Schneider is an "Unproven" goalie

NO!!! Cluterbuck is not worth Paaravi.

NO!!! We do not "Need" to win now. We need to improve and compete every year.

The real "Joke" is fans sacrificing the future for "maybe" now.

How has that worked for Toronto these past 50 years.

NO!!! We don't need 40 year old players nearing the end and a shadow of then selves.

You sound like Jason "Negative" Gregor. Every manager, every player, on every team is better than any Oiler.

We have the talent. Now, we need the supporting cast.

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#82 mike
July 01 2013, 05:44PM
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Craig MacTambellini. Mr. Dithers v2.0

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#83 nuge2nail
July 01 2013, 05:44PM
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Next up, is Connor McJesus. wrote:

Might have be another one of those deals where Minnesota just didn't want him to go to another western conference opponent.

Oiler Domination To Follow

Maybe it was one of those deals management didnt change a small peice to make the trade work.

Maybe take pitlick out an exchange him with a prospect who didnt have a horrible year.

That's a thought.

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#84 nuge2nail
July 01 2013, 05:51PM
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Colin wrote:

NO!!! Schneider is NOT worth what Vancouver asked edmonton for. Schneider is an "Unproven" goalie

NO!!! Cluterbuck is not worth Paaravi.

NO!!! We do not "Need" to win now. We need to improve and compete every year.

The real "Joke" is fans sacrificing the future for "maybe" now.

How has that worked for Toronto these past 50 years.

NO!!! We don't need 40 year old players nearing the end and a shadow of then selves.

You sound like Jason "Negative" Gregor. Every manager, every player, on every team is better than any Oiler.

We have the talent. Now, we need the supporting cast.

Oiler Domination To Follow

Schneider is not unproven. Nurse is unproven- make sense.

For this team the guy who leads the league in hits every year is more valuable than the soft European guy who can't score and can't play in the bottom six.- make sense.

We do not need to win now?!? Please make some sense.

Sacrifice the future for the now, creates a better future.

Our last 7 years have been worse than Torontos.

Look what that 40 year old did for Claude Girioux. Character helps create a culture change, and Nurse is 2 years away.

Most teams are better than the oilers, at least 29 teams most years and 24 teams this year. Do you understand that?

The infini-build is never ending. Is it so much to ask for one positive trade or a star signing per decade. If we are just going to build through the draft whats the point of having a management "team".

Maybe if you yell NO!!! long enough all our problems will go away.

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#85 Mean Machine
July 01 2013, 05:57PM
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DSF wrote:

Pitlick has almost zero value as a replacement for an actual NHL player.

He scored 3 goals and 7 assists in the AHL last season.

Nino scored 28 goals and 22 assists.

Clutterbuck is WORTH exactly what someone was willing to pay for him.

If MacT thinks he can procure actual NHL players in return for his junk on the farm, he's really going to need an attitude adjustment.

Way to ignore the second round pick. You know, a second round pick that was used to get Tyler Kennedy? Tyler Kennedy and Cal Clutterbuck scored similar points, near same age, played similar ice time.

So it wasn't just "junk on the farm"

Islanders really wanted him, so they overpaid. Simple as that.

By your definition there is no such thing as overpaying for a player. Disagree. Strong disagree.

EVERYONE EVERYONE the Oilers should call up the Islanders and trade Hall for Matt Martin. Don't worry we don't need to call anyone else because if the Islanders accept, then Hall is worth exactly what the Oilers received in return, Matt Martin!

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#86 Newj
July 01 2013, 05:59PM
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@Eddie Shore

Garth & the Isles are similar to Oil (except they made the playoffs last year)& need some added grit & defensive capable forwards.

IMO the Isles did the right thing and filled those needs but gave up a 5th overall 1st rounder for Cal. Nino was a gifted prospect who hadnt yet made their club. My guess is he needed to learn how to play in all 3 zones & spent time in minors learning that. As opposed to the Oilers who perhaps should do same ie - Yak, MPS, Gagner.

Maybe MacT could have parted with similar talent to fill a much needed void. Ie - Paarjavi in exchange for Clutterbuck. Paarjavi was a 10th overall in the year prior to Nino.

Lots have said Garth was fleeced but atleast he is trying to fill a void & gave up good value to get good value. Seems right now MacT isnt willing to do same.

Im not answering for DSF but we offered very little compared to NYI & both teams have similar needs plus similar assets to trade with.

Cal isnt the end all be all, but he is type of forward we lack. Dont know the exact stats but Cal lead league for a number of years in hits. Something we use a little more of.

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#87 WhattaMike
July 01 2013, 06:03PM
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Man!!!!! I hear the panic button going off by so many persons out there....that I thank Gawd that all those whiners and rushers that I speak of... are not runni8ng the Oilers cause the team would be so bad....

Get Clutterbuck off your minds once and for all. He is traded....and he is not worth a fifth overall player and a 2nd rounder!!!!!

IMO, he is replacable by others at a cheaper price ... and would have been not even thought of too much... if Hartikainen had wanted to sign a two way contract then give a real work ethic attitude...

Schneider is nor was ever "heads over heels" far better than Dubnyk!!!! He ain't nor is worth a (th overall pick nor...a #7, a 2nd rounder and an NHL ready player!!!!!

Khudobin...without giving away players/prospects/draft pick costs, etc, plus his salary... is a definite more worthwhile venture to go get as a UFA, so is Emery

Bolland is not worth what Toronto gave nor what Chicago originally wanted.The Oilers can go get players such as Gordon instead...

Until those out there making sane and realistic sense and/or suggest proper options then don't even bother writing anything here...

I am not a perfect Oilers fan but I am one of for over 30 yrs and...I do enjoy reading of those who make good real sense and/or points on here...

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#88 Jimmer
July 01 2013, 06:09PM
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Clutterbuck for Neiderreiter in a lot of ways is similar to Cody Hodgson for Zach Kassian. Two teams with two very different needs. One needing skill the other needing grit. In today's NHL...both are equally important.

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#89 nuge2nail
July 01 2013, 06:14PM
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WhattaMike wrote:

Man!!!!! I hear the panic button going off by so many persons out there....that I thank Gawd that all those whiners and rushers that I speak of... are not runni8ng the Oilers cause the team would be so bad....

Get Clutterbuck off your minds once and for all. He is traded....and he is not worth a fifth overall player and a 2nd rounder!!!!!

IMO, he is replacable by others at a cheaper price ... and would have been not even thought of too much... if Hartikainen had wanted to sign a two way contract then give a real work ethic attitude...

Schneider is nor was ever "heads over heels" far better than Dubnyk!!!! He ain't nor is worth a (th overall pick nor...a #7, a 2nd rounder and an NHL ready player!!!!!

Khudobin...without giving away players/prospects/draft pick costs, etc, plus his salary... is a definite more worthwhile venture to go get as a UFA, so is Emery

Bolland is not worth what Toronto gave nor what Chicago originally wanted.The Oilers can go get players such as Gordon instead...

Until those out there making sane and realistic sense and/or suggest proper options then don't even bother writing anything here...

I am not a perfect Oilers fan but I am one of for over 30 yrs and...I do enjoy reading of those who make good real sense and/or points on here...

Oiler Domination To Follow

How could the team have been worse?

30, 30, 29, 24

Trade for Z Smith, sign Ference and Jagr.

Put together a package with our 2014 first rounder, Paarajvi, Marincin, etc For Seguin

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#90 WhattaMike
July 01 2013, 06:18PM
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@Jimmer

I agree with ya and thats why I am not too worried about the deal not working out for MacT.

Neiderreiter wanted out, he had attitude issues, and he played pouter so as to get this going so that is why the Islanders didn't care for losing him...

I am thinking also that Pitlick has just come around the corner himself during the playoffs and he can be even better than Clutterbuck with much better skating skills and he is good to hit-wise at the least. Besides this kid is only what 20 or 21 right now???

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#91 2004Z06
July 01 2013, 06:21PM
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You bitch when a GM doesn't say squat to the media and you bitch when the new GM is open and candid to the media. No GM can win in this town with the fans.

Mac T didn't "promise" any of you jack S***. He stated they needed and wanted to make bold moves, but that doesn't mean stupid moves just to give bloggers something to talk about. If no one is dealing, or the prices are to high, you stand pat. He replaced a ton of assets that can be used as trade chips going forward if need be.

We all agree the Oilers have had nothing anyone wants, well maybe now going forward they do.

I know that drafting Nurse may make at least one of the decent D prospects tradeable.

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#92 15w40
July 01 2013, 06:21PM
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I don't know why people continue to argue with the "anti-oiler".

If Edmonton had traded the 1st, a 2nd, and a top prospect for Schneider, he would be on here trumpeting from the rooftops about what a rookie hack Mactavish is and how he got totally fleeced and that Mike Gillis schooled him.

It doesn't matter what moves the Oilers make or don't make - they will be WRONG, 100% of the time.

And in the event they ever get good or actually win the cup it will be because even a blind squirrel gets an acorn sometimes.

Should Edmonton have sweetened the deal for Clutterbuck - yes. Should they have gone with somebody like Pajaarvi - maybe. Nino Niederreiter was a special case because the milk had already gone sour between his camp and NYI. Maybe Edmonton should have traded Pajaarvi for him instead of Clutterbuck.

The Oilers will not win the cup this year and may end up buying out Horcoff. I don't see Hemsky as a candidate for that.

High end UFA's will not come here either. So you draft and you trade - Nurse is just what the doctor ordered.

Such is the life of the most northerly outpost of the NHL.

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#93 WhattaMike
July 01 2013, 06:22PM
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@Nuge2 nail

I like how ya want to get this going.. Use assets and options that are realistic IMO...

If next yrs draft is a weak one then ya use that 2014 first roundere and some package deal offers to get a good to very great top line centre or winger, especially if the type UFA deals are not the right course..

That being said the Oilers should go first for two of three such players in the UFA area...Horton (maybe Stalberg), Khudobin or Emery..then start for those 3rd and 4th liner deals..

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#94 Newj
July 01 2013, 06:28PM
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@WhattaMike

For the record it wasnt a 5th overall (Nino) & a 2nd round for Brylcream Man.Just Nino plus NYI got a late pick somewhere in the coming decade.

No Cal...fine..but someone with a little jam & can put together a few cognitive thoughts in our own zone.

BTW, I'll quit posting such asinine thoughts.

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#95 WhattaMike
July 01 2013, 06:37PM
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@Newj

Thanks for heads up on trade for clutterbuck...I somehow thought a pick was involved as well.

Yep...I agree with ya that we need some aggressive tough boys for the team and its too bad Harty was one who didnt seem to want to work at it.. But ya gotta at least agree to not overpay or do something too rash to get what the Oilers need don't ya?

There are also good fair trades for out there to be done but not at the expense of the talent thats been signed/drafted...with Ebs, Hall, RNH, Yak, Schultz, Klefbom and now Nurse.

It took this long and four bad seasons plus to get these kids and now too many want to let go of one or two already? Whatcha think?

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#96 Walter Sobchak
July 01 2013, 06:50PM
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WhattaMike wrote:

@Nuge2 nail

I like how ya want to get this going.. Use assets and options that are realistic IMO...

If next yrs draft is a weak one then ya use that 2014 first roundere and some package deal offers to get a good to very great top line centre or winger, especially if the type UFA deals are not the right course..

That being said the Oilers should go first for two of three such players in the UFA area...Horton (maybe Stalberg), Khudobin or Emery..then start for those 3rd and 4th liner deals..

exactly what assets?

This is what a lot of hoodwink optimistic fans think like.

FYI - Next years draft is a deeper draft then this years, so just giving away that pick is borderline insane.

You and a few other posters just complained about selling the future for gains now, interestingly enough you turn around and mention free agency and draft picks to support your cause.

I'll take you back to the start of the 2007 when the good ship Oiler started completely falling off a cliff.

The Oilers went whale hunting to support and already depleted core.

The Oilers lacked among other things an elite goalie.

They lacked any semblance of a third line and a depleted defensive core.

They has some scoring but no supporting cast.

No power forwards, the one power forward they had they let leave over a couple hundred thousand dollars.

The Oilers were chasing allusive UFA's and not watching the rest of the team crumbling around them.

The Oilers are in this mess for many, many reasons, the biggest is over spending, chasing over aged, over priced injury prone players.

your solution is to do the same?

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#97 Rusty Patenaude
July 01 2013, 06:57PM
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I am not disappointed at the lack of deals by MacT yesterday. The asking prices for Coburn and Clutterbuck were too high. My concern was that MacT would feel compelled to make deals because of his foolish "I'm impatient" declaration...he did not make dumb deals, that is good.

There is plenty of time to negotiate the deals needed. The time to judge MacT will be at the beginning of camp and beyond.

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#98 DSF
July 01 2013, 06:58PM
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15w40 wrote:

I don't know why people continue to argue with the "anti-oiler".

If Edmonton had traded the 1st, a 2nd, and a top prospect for Schneider, he would be on here trumpeting from the rooftops about what a rookie hack Mactavish is and how he got totally fleeced and that Mike Gillis schooled him.

It doesn't matter what moves the Oilers make or don't make - they will be WRONG, 100% of the time.

And in the event they ever get good or actually win the cup it will be because even a blind squirrel gets an acorn sometimes.

Should Edmonton have sweetened the deal for Clutterbuck - yes. Should they have gone with somebody like Pajaarvi - maybe. Nino Niederreiter was a special case because the milk had already gone sour between his camp and NYI. Maybe Edmonton should have traded Pajaarvi for him instead of Clutterbuck.

The Oilers will not win the cup this year and may end up buying out Horcoff. I don't see Hemsky as a candidate for that.

High end UFA's will not come here either. So you draft and you trade - Nurse is just what the doctor ordered.

Such is the life of the most northerly outpost of the NHL.

The Oilers need to plug one hole at a time and Schneider would have plugged a hole.

Just listened to a radio interview with Gillis and the Oilers did NOT offer a 1st, a roster player and a good prospect. I have no idea what the Oilers offered but it obviously wasn't enough.

Whiff.

We do know the Oilers offered Pitlick and a 2nd for Clutterbuck and the Wild declined instead taking a player who scored 50 points in the AHL over a player who scored 10 points in the AHL. No brainer.

Whiff.

We don't know what else MacT was in on but he came home empty handed in his quest for a goalie, a second line centre, a top 6 winger a top 4 defenseman and any player who can play in the bottom 6 in the next 2-3 years.

Whiff

Whiff

Whiff

He can redeem himself somewhat in free agency but time is short and the price just went up.

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#99 DSF
July 01 2013, 06:59PM
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WhattaMike wrote:

@Newj

Thanks for heads up on trade for clutterbuck...I somehow thought a pick was involved as well.

Yep...I agree with ya that we need some aggressive tough boys for the team and its too bad Harty was one who didnt seem to want to work at it.. But ya gotta at least agree to not overpay or do something too rash to get what the Oilers need don't ya?

There are also good fair trades for out there to be done but not at the expense of the talent thats been signed/drafted...with Ebs, Hall, RNH, Yak, Schultz, Klefbom and now Nurse.

It took this long and four bad seasons plus to get these kids and now too many want to let go of one or two already? Whatcha think?

Who are you going to trade that has any value?

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#100 Eddie Shore
July 01 2013, 07:00PM
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@Newj

Nino for Clutterbuck only happened because he and the Islanders had a falling out.

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