TRADING MARINCIN

Lowetide
August 02 2013 07:36AM

 

Martin Marincin is developing as a very nice prospect for future NHL employment. His progress from junior to pro this past season had some bumpy moments, but by season's end he was well inside the top 4D at evens and a feature player for much of the year 5x4. Martin Marincin has a problem though: he's boxed in. Klefbom ahead of him, Nurse behind, and man there's not a lot of room.  

In junior, Marincin stories surrounded his height and lack of lower body strength, and the subpar team he played for in Prince George. Early in his first pro season, he caught an enormous break--being paired with Justin Schultz--and for a time the spotlight shone on Marincin in a big way:

  • Steve Tambellini in October: “His natural instincts for the game are very good … coming into the Saturday game, he was leading the American (Hockey) League in plus minus. That speaks to his hockey sense. When I look at Martin, I also see a strong ability to pass the puck. His body has to get stronger from a defensive standpoint. He’s a six-foot-four, six-foot-five kid, but is he is pretty lean (187 pounds). That said, when you watch him, he has an excellent stick for poke-checking.”

The Hockey News has an excellent scouting report on most of the NHL players and prospects we talk about, and I like their summary on Marincin (here).

  • The Hockey News: Is quite lanky, with a very projectable 6-5 frame. Boasts great puck-moving qualities and offensive acumen. Also displays plenty of shutdown upside. Doesn't play enough of a physical game, which he will have to improve upon in order to maximize his all-round potential at the National Hockey League level.

Marincin's size, skill set and youth (he's 21) make him an attractive option for any team, including the Oilers. In fact, if they could mail him back to 2008 chances are Marincin would have an exceptional future with the Oilers.

WE HAVE A PROBLEM

Marincin, 21 and a few defensive sorties from being ready for his first NHL game (which is followed by a longer period in the NHL and then finally arrival), is being passed by players procured after he was selected (2nd round, 2010). It's not his fault--Marincin is a terrific defensive prospect--but he's in a zone where he may be 'available' for trade.

When the Oilers took Marincin--Frank Musil pushed hard for his selection--the prospect depth chart was rail thin. Here's what the Oilers had bubbling under on the blue in 2010 summer: Jeff Petry, Theo Peckham, Marincin (just drafted), Alex Plante, Taylor Chorney, Johan Motin, Troy Hesketh and Kyle Bigos. 

Fast forward to the current prospect list, and it's truly insane:

  • Darnell Nurse
  • Oscar Klefbom
  • Martin Marincin
  • Martin Gernat
  • Dillon Simpson
  • David Musil

That's kind of my point, this list right here.  If the Edmonton Oilers begin the season and decide they badly need something, teams will be asking after someone on this list (it's the area of greatest strength for the Oilers, so MacT would probably be more open to a deal for a defender, too). 

One assumes Nurse and Klefbom are untouchable, but what about Marincin? Is he a lock for future employment or will the team move forward with a future top 4 of Nurse, Petry, Klefbom, J Schultz? 

WHAT DOES IT ALL MEAN?

The Oilers finally have a prospect depth chart on defense that is clearly going to produce legit big league talent. My question for you is this: WHERE is the line in the sand for untouchables? Before or after Martin Marincin? Because I'd bet money he's going to receive a lot of interest in the next 12 months, and you can't play everybody. 

(Marincin photos by Rob Ferguson, all rights reserved)

C2a6955161684b5e3189319acfa5ebe4
Lowetide has been one of the Oilogosphere's shining lights for over a century. You can check him out here at OilersNation and at lowetide.ca. He is also the host of Lowdown with Lowetide weekday mornings 10-noon on Team 1260.
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#1 K_Mart
August 02 2013, 07:53AM
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No one is untouchable except Kevin Costner and Sean Connery. ... And Darnell Nurse. Klefbom can be dealt

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#2 DSF
August 02 2013, 11:05AM
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They're $hittie wrote:

No DSF comments since the trash button has been introduced?

Mission accomplished.

Nope.

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#3 DSF
August 02 2013, 11:21AM
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Jon Rosen ‏@lakingsinsider 5m

And there you go... RT @mayorNHL CONFIRMED: LA Kings have new deal in place with Kyle Clifford http://mayorsmanor.com/?p=19592

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#4 Woogie63
August 02 2013, 08:12AM
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Wow...it must be July.

Marincin has not played a game in the NHL and we are trading him, so we can protect two players that have not played a pro game in their life.

Truly we don't have a depth chart, we have six hopefuls, and about 5 very average NHL defenseman.

Lets not trade anyone until they have played 20-30 NHL games so we can see what we have got.

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#5 Hags9k
August 02 2013, 08:04AM
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Good post LT. My untouchable list would include only Nurse. If the club feels there isn't a big gap from Klefbom to Marincin, then maybe Klefbom is the trade piece. It all depends on the return but my line in the sand is Darnell.

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#6 rickithebear
August 02 2013, 11:32PM
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Smid - petry had the 3rd best GA fro dmen who faced the best. 3rd best! top Pairing! 3rd is not a Top pairing! so there are 2 top pairings. only 2 top pairings! the other 28 teams top 1st comp dpair are 2nd pairings. Bahahahahahahaha.

There are alot of hunter s. thompson's on this site. 2 top pairings ! unbelievable!

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#7 Manfly
August 02 2013, 12:47PM
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^what about him? i don't think he has much of a future here, unless you mean as trade bait?

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#8 DSF
August 02 2013, 08:38PM
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justDOit wrote:

Does anyone know why the trash button is about 4 times larger than the props? And with text and an exclamation point to boot! The props button gets no benefit of literary devices like these.

The Trash Truck ® takes up that many pixels.

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#9 DSF
August 02 2013, 08:37PM
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Pajamah wrote:

DSF posts that L.A. and Kyle Clifford have a deal in place, citing a tweet.

TRASH COMMENT 67 TIMES!!!!

I'm all for trashing a comment if the you disagree with the content, but just because you don't like the guy? Really?

Forgive them for they know not what they do.

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#10 The Last Big Bear
August 02 2013, 12:07PM
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Marincin is a prospect, who may or may not make The Show, and will probably top out as a middle-pairing guy if all goes well.

He's the kind of prospect that virtually every NHL team has, and is probably the Oilers' 5th best defender aged 25 or under. He's also unlikely to overtake any of the guys above him.

So how does this warrant putting him on an 'untouchables' list? It's not as if 'depth defencemen' is an organizational weakness, and it's certainly not as if they're hard to come across (heck, the Oilers just added three middle-pairing guys this off season).

Marincin is a perfectly tradeable asset.

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#11 Pajamah
August 02 2013, 08:59AM
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The ability to trash comments. Oh, I can't hardly wait for the first time I disagree with an opinion in a Gregor or Brownlee article.

LT, what kind of return do you think MacT could get for Marincin? Or do you think he becomes a piece of something bigger?

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#12 MessyEH!
August 02 2013, 08:38AM
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Lowetide why do you hate Martin Marincin?

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#13 harp
August 02 2013, 10:13AM
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I can see Marincin being pack of a package in a trade as others have mentioned by why would any team want him alone when dealing a legit NHL player. Is he anything special? The answer is no.

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#14 Sliderule
August 02 2013, 08:07AM
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Marincin is our most advanced defense prospect.He has played very well as a rookie in the AHL . Our next best prospect Klefbom has hardly played in the last two years. Our bright new prospect Nurse is skinny as a rail and is at least three years away from a sniff at NHL. So it is not logical that MacT will be suckered into trading our most NHL ready prospect for a Ben Eager clone that a lot of folks are salivating about. Right!

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#15 madjam
August 02 2013, 08:17AM
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Let them keep developing in minors to replace the ones on parent club . We want depth , then we keep all of them until the age of 25-26 . If they haven't cracked parent club by then , then they go the way of Plante and Teubert ,Peckham , and others . Not sure about Simpson , and do not know if he would carry any value in a trade at this stage .

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#16 kelvjn
August 02 2013, 08:40AM
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"...strong ability to pass the puck. His body has to get stronger from a defensive standpoint. He’s a six-foot-four, six-foot-five kid, but is he is pretty lean (187 pounds). That said, when you watch him, he has an excellent stick for poke-checking.”

So basically second coming of Poti?

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#17 Spydyr
August 02 2013, 04:25PM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:

He was rushed because he earned his job at camp. He just wasn't ready for it.

If he wasn't ready for it he did not earn it.It was given to him.

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#18 seanjohn
August 03 2013, 09:53AM
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Smokey wrote:

I've looked at Nurse, Klefbom, Marincin, Gernat as untouchables unless in a deal for a number 1 defender. When people "throw in" Gernat and Marincin into deals they want. Let all theses defenders develop slowly, and in 3 years we will have the best group of young defence in the league.

there is logic to this view. my fear with this is two fold:

1. by the time Nurse/Klefbom/Marincin/Gernat are a great D-core, Eberle and Hall will be near the end of their contracts. if you are comfortable with the Oil winning with above D-core + RNH/Yak + whatever you trade Ebs/Hall for as the REAL core, then fine, I suppose. i don't want to wait that long.

2. this fan base is on the verge of exploding. many have had enough with Klowe's act and are ready to pull the pin because they know he is there for life. i, myself, have adopted a 2nd favourite team to cheer for in the playoffs since i can barely remember the feeling of cheering for a winning Oilers club. the Oilers are near becoming like the Bluejays/Raptors for many people: the team we cheer for because they're close to home, until August comes and we cheer for the the Cardinals/Dodgers or Spurs/Thunder.

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#19 cableguy - 2nd Tier Fan
August 02 2013, 08:15AM
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Woogie63 wrote:

Wow...it must be July.

Marincin has not played a game in the NHL and we are trading him, so we can protect two players that have not played a pro game in their life.

Truly we don't have a depth chart, we have six hopefuls, and about 5 very average NHL defenseman.

Lets not trade anyone until they have played 20-30 NHL games so we can see what we have got.

since it is actually August is it ok for us to discuss trading prospects again?

asking for a friend.

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#20 Oiltimer
August 02 2013, 09:58AM
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I still like the idea of combining that stellar sport of wife carrying with cheese rolling.

A new Olympic challenge sport !!

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#21 Woogie63
August 02 2013, 10:08AM
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cableguy - 2nd Tier Fan wrote:

since it is actually August is it ok for us to discuss trading prospects again?

asking for a friend.

:)

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#22 Spydyr
August 02 2013, 03:28PM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:

Haven't you repeatedly cried about Gagner being "ruined" because they let him earn a job in camp?

Gagner was not ready he did not earn a job in camp.He still can't play in his own end of the rink.He was rushed like far too many Oiler players.

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#23 godot10
August 02 2013, 03:22PM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:

My favorite thing about this comment is the implication that you would not trade Marincin for Weber because of cap concerns.

Fact. The Oilers are currently basically at the cap.

Weber would put them way over the cap. So any trade for Weber, even if it is only Marincin, involves getting rid of a lot of other stuff at bargain prices.

Now, if you are another GM, and go way over the cap in the off-season, are you going to let MacT off the hook. You aren't going to be able to dump junk. GM's are going to be asking for 1st round draft picks to go with junk, or they are going to be asking for one of the fab 5 at a bargain price.

The Oilers cannot give Ales Hemsky away at the moment. If you go 10% over, which a Marincin for Weber trade would do at this moment, then MacT is basically dropping his pants, bending over, and ...

You cannot divorce cap considerations from trade considerations in actual reality, like you can in the blogosphere.

One cannot discuss a trade for Weber without discussing how to fit him under the cap.

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#24 Hammers
August 02 2013, 11:25PM
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harp wrote:

I can see Marincin being pack of a package in a trade as others have mentioned by why would any team want him alone when dealing a legit NHL player. Is he anything special? The answer is no.

You have no idea .

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#25 I am the Liquor
August 03 2013, 09:43AM
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Where's the steaming pile of crap option?

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#26 They're $hittie
August 02 2013, 09:51AM
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No DSF comments since the trash button has been introduced?

Mission accomplished.

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#27 godot10
August 02 2013, 02:00PM
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Spydyr wrote:

Madjam would trade Marincin straight up for Weber.

Please list all the other players you would have to get rid of at bargain prices to fit Weber under the cap.

Winning in a hard cap system is all about value for money.

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#28 Romulus' Apotheosis
August 02 2013, 09:08AM
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"Here's what the Oilers had bubbling under on the blue in 2010 bubbling under"

That's some kind of underwater volcanic event!

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#29 Archaeologuy
August 02 2013, 08:01AM
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I am not of the mind that Marincin HAS to be traded at all, but the truth is that any team who would be a willing trade partner with Edmonton HAS to be asking for this player.

He is the best prospect who isnt off limits. He has a lot of things that are desireable to other teams. Some draft pedigree, size, youth, and now pro experience.

When the Oilers upgrade their defense it may come from a (1 NHLer + 1 Prospect + 1 Pick) = Top Pairing Defender type equation. If that's the case then Marincin's name will be asked for to fill the Prospect spot.

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#30 Craig1981
August 02 2013, 09:02AM
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A prospect is just that. Nurse and kelfbom could turn out to be busts. And his offense could turn out to be toop shelf.

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#31 Quicksilver ballet
August 02 2013, 10:31PM
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If the Oilers have to move one of Klefbom, Nurse or Marincin for help this season. Moving Martin is a no brainer. Marincin and the first in 14 should help land a 2nd line center type like Couturier, unless he's untouchable like Seguin was.

I'd see if Petry and the first in exchange for Mezsaros and Couturier would get Holmgrens attention. Many would like to see management punch that accelerator now than wait for what might not be in two yrs. Heck, throw in Dubnyk into the talks and see where it goes. Our chances are every bit as good with LaBarberra as the starter as they are with Dubnyk. Bring in Theodore if you have to and help bridge the gap till MacT finds his guy. Buy out/move Hemsky if you have to and make room.

American leaguers inside your top four depth at center before the season even starts is a recipe for disaster. There's atleast hope in a top 5 that included RNH,Gagner,Couturier,Gordon and Acton/Miller/Arc heading into this coming season.

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#32 Ron Burgundy
August 02 2013, 08:43AM
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cableguy - 2nd Tier Fan wrote:

since it is actually August is it ok for us to discuss trading prospects again?

asking for a friend.

And there you have it folks, the first truly prop-worthy post in ON history.

I initially disagreed with this article, but as I look at Capgeek I think you may be right LT, there is not much room at the inn.

None this year, but with injuries perhaps we see him on the big club for a few games. Next year there are currently lots of openings (only Smid and Ference are signed beyond this year), but we better be re-signing Schultz, and are probably re-signing Petry (though if you want to talk about tradeable assets...)

Klefbom then arrives next year, and do you really want two rookie blue in your top 6? That probably means you re-sign one or both of the Russians. Plus there is Larsen. Marincin's deal then expires. Perhaps you re-up him, but the year after that is the same story as Nurse will(should) be ready.

In some ways it is up to the kid here I think - if he can make someone else expendible then maybe someone else goes and he gets a chair when the music stops. But as of today he seems like a good candidate to be the one standing.

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#33 Manfly
August 02 2013, 11:58AM
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no chance do i want Marincin dealt. if one of our prospect d-men have to go, i'd rather it be David Musil.

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#34 Tim in Kelowna
August 02 2013, 11:14PM
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Good piece LT, but can we go ahead and never use a Tambellini quote ever again. He is clearly the dumbest and most embarrassing GM the Oilers have ever had.

Your take on Marincin is something I had never considered but when you laid out the D prospect depth chart I was very encouraged. It seems that one of these Dmen would make a good piece in a trade to fill another hole in the big league roster (i.e. toughness, size).

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#35 Smokey
August 02 2013, 08:02AM
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I've looked at Nurse, Klefbom, Marincin, Gernat as untouchables unless in a deal for a number 1 defender. When people "throw in" Gernat and Marincin into deals they want. Let all theses defenders develop slowly, and in 3 years we will have the best group of young defence in the league.

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#36 GNikkles
August 03 2013, 12:27AM
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@rickithebear

Buddy... Get it together.

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#37 ghostofberanek
August 02 2013, 10:24AM
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@borisnikov

I agree fully, Marincin's a keeper and Gernat should be the trade piece (the problem being every other NHL team sees his defensive deficiencies as clearly as the Oil do). Your solution of moving him up to forward is good, outside the box thinking with no risk and (potentially) big reward. Just what I'd expect from a fellow class of '97 alumni ;)

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#38 Ogden Brother Jr. - Team Strudwick for coach
August 02 2013, 12:29PM
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I'd trade any of our prospects for the right price.

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#39 hammers
August 02 2013, 01:40PM
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Anyone is tradeable but that includes nurse or klefbom .you don't trade a 1st year'd'who had a good ahl season unless the return is a proven top 4 'd' who's cap maybe high or any other reason . Untill klefbom shows what he can do in the ahl we wait . As for nurse his going back to junior and anything can happen like injuries or a fall off .If all goes well i see all 3 in oiler uniforms with justin . Petry maybe the one traded if you think on it .

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#40 Pajamah
August 02 2013, 08:35PM
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DSF posts that L.A. and Kyle Clifford have a deal in place, citing a tweet.

TRASH COMMENT 67 TIMES!!!!

I'm all for trashing a comment if the you disagree with the content, but just because you don't like the guy? Really?

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#41 horndog77
August 02 2013, 09:54AM
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Justin Schultz / Jeff Petry/ Oscar klefbom/ Darnell Nurse and perhaps Martin, those should be the future of the defense. Any other current player should be used to upgrade the third and fourth lines. Not saying to trade players like Smid and newly acquired Ference this year but teams will get injuries and by my count Edmonton has too many D

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#42 Spydyr
August 02 2013, 02:50PM
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Fresh Mess wrote:

At least we have seen Marincin perform at the AHL level getting serious minutes.

Klefbom has played one year in the SEL getting low/soft minutes and then spent a year injured. Let's just ease off the hype and see how things unfold in October for starters.

But,but the kool-aid is so tasty.

I just hope that they actually let players earn or lose a job in camp this year.For too many years now the team was picked before camp opened.

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#43 Rocket
August 02 2013, 04:33PM
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I don't know if they can keep all of their top D prospects. If it works out, then great for The Oilers but I don't see it happening. If trades are required to make the team better, any of the D prospects are going to be targeted above the forwards minus the kids.

Is trading Marincin & Klefbom worth a second line centre? I don't know but it would be interesting to see who they could get.

I hope they keep & sign them but with the cap fluctuating the way it does from year to year I wonder if The Oilers can fit them all in.

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#44 Citizen Alpha
August 02 2013, 09:45PM
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justDOit wrote:

Does anyone know why the trash button is about 4 times larger than the props? And with text and an exclamation point to boot! The props button gets no benefit of literary devices like these.

It's a new and sponsored feature, so we wanted to give it some emphasis. The dimensions may change over time.

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#45 seanjohn
August 03 2013, 09:31AM
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i suspect Marincin was untouchable in Tambo's eyes. Yes, it is possible that he will eventually be more valuable then the player you bring in which was always Tambo's greatest fear. but, I don't think Mact feels this way. Trade him for a useful roster NHLer in a heartbeat. that's why you collected assets, to trade them for useful pieces when the time is right, and that's now.

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#46 seanjohn
August 03 2013, 09:36AM
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russ99 wrote:

The Chara comparisons are interesting, but Marincin has been compared to Chara since before he was drafted.

With Marincin's improvement in play over the last season on OKC it behooves the Oilers to wait and see on Marincin. It is true, he could fill out and become a heck of a player and he'd be a valued inexpensive piece on a cap team next year.

IMO Marincin has a better chance of helping the Oilers this year than Klefbom, who's raw, missed significant time hampering development, and needs substantial ice time in OKC to get use to North American hockey. The decision between who to keep between Marincin and Klefbom would be better made next summer.

It also seems that the "trade Marincin" crowd is thinking so since we really have nobody else left to trade. :)

you are right. along with the lack of patience. i am thru with waiting for the final prospect to finally develop into a player. that's why Tambo got fired. no more waiting. the time to act is now. it doesn't necessarily mean Marincin (tho he is the player opposing GMs will ask about), just any prospect. simple speed up the process. the rebuild should be over. it is time for this organization to compete in the here and now.

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#47 Harry
August 03 2013, 04:27PM
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I am the Liquor wrote:

Where's the steaming pile of crap option?

Massive PROPS for the pic and name. WELL DONE!!

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#48 MessyEH!
August 02 2013, 08:25AM
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Unless it's a proven top pairing dman, I wouldn't trade any of them.

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#49 Sliderule
August 02 2013, 09:02AM
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kelvjn wrote:

"...strong ability to pass the puck. His body has to get stronger from a defensive standpoint. He’s a six-foot-four, six-foot-five kid, but is he is pretty lean (187 pounds). That said, when you watch him, he has an excellent stick for poke-checking.”

So basically second coming of Poti?

The oilers website lists Marincin as 6 ft 5 and 196 lbs.

He is filling out and probably will be over 200 lbs this season.

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#50 John Chambers
August 02 2013, 09:33AM
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Craig1981 wrote:

A prospect is just that. Nurse and kelfbom could turn out to be busts. And his offense could turn out to be toop shelf.

Indeed. It makes sense to wait 24 months to make a trade in order to a) see what kind of players Klefbom, Nurse, Marincin, & Gernat turn into, and b) hopefully augment their trade value between now and then.

Marincin could turn into Roman Josi, and could be a very useful value contract while the big boys are getting paid.

That said, Marincin + N Schultz + a pick for Byfuglien or Enstrom puts this team into the playoffs.

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