WHAT WOULD GAGNER FETCH THESE DAYS?

Lowetide
January 07 2014 07:10PM

TSN reported tonight that the "ask" for Sam Gagner is a top 6 forward, a top 4D or a starting goaltender. What would that look like? 

TRADE FOR ANOTHER GAGNER? TOP 6F

Gagner's contract (just signed this summer) is a $4.8 million dollar cap hit times three seasons (including this one), so there's clearly a need to have him inside the top 6F. The players in Gagner's cap hit range offer an interesting idea about what that kind of money buys you in today's NHL; I think Bryan Little is (45, 14-20-34) a good comparable for Gagner, about the same dollars and their point totals per 82 games march in lock step:

  • Little per 82gp: 21-27-48
  • Gagner per 82gp: 18-32-50

That seems about right, I think Little's current season would give him more value, but Gagner's coming on and has a solid offensive resume despite warts at center.

FANCY STATS COMPARABLES

12-13

13-14

The two season comparison from extra skater offers us a unique look at the two players (man, does shooting percentage make a difference) and shows the Corsi for % goes to the Jet.

TOP 4D

 

The Penguins have a ton of young defensemen and prospects, so maybe Gagner to the Pens could work (hat tip to Jonathan Willis for the Lavoie tweet). Could Gagner replace Dupuis?

Among the Pens blue, I really like Kris Letang, but can't imagine the Pens moving him—and of course Gagner's value is not close to Letang's worth despite the difference in cap dollars. Pittsburgh has a lot of defensive prospects, but so does Edmonton, and I don't see a forward match here either. The two teams would have to be creative to get anything done. Do you see a match?

STARTING GOALIE

This is even-strength save percentage, NHL 2013-14. See anyone you like? Martin Jones is an interesting name, as is Ben Scrivens for that matter. Reimer in Toronto has been rumored heading here from time to time, and Jonas Hiller might end up being an Oiler via free agency this summer.

WHAT DOES IT ALL MEAN?

Chances are Gagner will be dealt after the Olympics to a team in need of offense. I'll guess eastern conference, and will guess that it won't be a goalie. Beyond that, I'm out. Any guesses?

C2a6955161684b5e3189319acfa5ebe4
Lowetide has been one of the Oilogosphere's shining lights for over a century. You can check him out here at OilersNation and at lowetide.ca. He is also the host of Lowdown with Lowetide weekday mornings 10-noon on Team 1260.
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#101 pkam
January 08 2014, 11:28AM
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Spoils wrote:

Nobody is untradeable as long as you improve the fit of the team with the trade. think Avs trading all three of their #1 overalls prior to winning Stanley.

Why not package Gagner up with someone else. At this point I would go to Nashville and say - you have great D and need scoring...

Pick one from bucket A and one from bucket B and give us Shea Weber or Seth Jones - your pick.

Bucket A = RNH, THall, Eberle, JSchultz, Yak,

Bucket B = Perron, Gagner, Hemsky, Klefbom,

etc.

No1 D. Pronger styles...

BOLDMOVES time.

Easy choice for Poile.

Hall + Perron for Jones.

Hall was 1st overall 4 years ago. Despite playing off position for a few games to start the season, he is now 4th LW in PPG, although his team is 2nd last in standing. Not to mention his 6+ years left in his 6M contract, one of the best contracts you can find.

Jones is just a rookie, although he has a lot of potential, it is just potential.

We have a pretty good chance to draft Ekblad this year, why would we want to give up Hall + Perron for Jones? Is Jones really that much better than Aaron Ekblad?

I hope MacT is not that naive.

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#102 pkam
January 08 2014, 11:51AM
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Serious Gord wrote:

If MacT wants that much for gagner he should be fired.

No team in their right mind is valuing gagner as a net positive asset. That MacT so grossly overvalued him must make him a laughing stock among the GMs (the third in a row).

Lowetide that you would even post at length possible trades makes me shake my head...

Nobody in their right mind should believe we can trade Horcoff for more than a bag of pucks and without getting a bad contract back. I guess MacT should be fired already for asking Philips Larsen + 7th rounder for Horcoff.

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#103 The Oilers Shot Clock
January 08 2014, 11:56AM
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Montreal must be looking for centers. Briere plays limited minutes and Gally is hurt. Gagner plus Klefbom for Gallagher?

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#104 pkam
January 08 2014, 12:03PM
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The Oilers Shot Clock wrote:

Montreal must be looking for centers. Briere plays limited minutes and Gally is hurt. Gagner plus Klefbom for Gallagher?

Gagner + Klefbom for Gallagher? Are you a Habs fan?

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#105 Truth
January 08 2014, 12:11PM
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Yak for Pacioretty and a pick.

Pacioretty has taken a little heat in Montreal, Yak gets a lot of heat in Edmonton. Yak has a higher upside. If I was Montreal I would like the idea of Galchenyuk and Yak back together.

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#106 The Oilers Shot Clock
January 08 2014, 12:12PM
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I doubt it's enough from Montreals perspective.

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#107 oilerjed
January 08 2014, 12:20PM
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Truth wrote:

Yak for Pacioretty and a pick.

Pacioretty has taken a little heat in Montreal, Yak gets a lot of heat in Edmonton. Yak has a higher upside. If I was Montreal I would like the idea of Galchenyuk and Yak back together.

And replacing Yak isnt solving any of our problems. He will come around and be a scoring machine but we will still be soft at center and Defence.

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#108 The Oilers Shot Clock
January 08 2014, 12:23PM
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If Sam could get 2 legitimate and productive 3rd and 4th liners I'd make that trade. I'd give him to Washington for Chimera and Fehr.

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#109 TeddyTurnbuckle
January 08 2014, 12:31PM
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Worse than Cogliano - check Making more than Cogliano - check

Good luck with this one Mac t

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#110 Serious Gord
January 08 2014, 12:34PM
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pkam wrote:

Nobody in their right mind should believe we can trade Horcoff for more than a bag of pucks and without getting a bad contract back. I guess MacT should be fired already for asking Philips Larsen + 7th rounder for Horcoff.

Larsen was a bad contract/poor player in return for a worse contract and somewhat better player.

Horcoff has played 41 games this season. Larsen has played 16.

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#111 Ed in Edmonton
January 08 2014, 12:35PM
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Perhaps MacT is just asking high and seeing what interest is out there. Gagner will be very difficult to move for anything of value.

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#112 TigerUnderGlass
January 08 2014, 12:39PM
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oilerjed wrote:

And replacing Yak isnt solving any of our problems. He will come around and be a scoring machine but we will still be soft at center and Defence.

I just want to make sure I'm getting the hang of Oiler fandom.

Pacioretty is taller than Yakupov, so this would automatically be a trade win, right?

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#113 2004Z06
January 08 2014, 12:59PM
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Serious Gord wrote:

Hard to see how gagner would be a better winger than he is a centre. Far too small to go and dig pucks, not much of a playmaker. If this were an option with upside i suspect that it would have been tried already.

He was a winger when he entered the league and coincidentally his best season in points. He may not be big, or win a lot of puck battles, but he is fast enough to get in on the fore-check and as a winger, he doesn't need to be the playmaker. The center is usually the playmaker. It also alleviates the defensive responsibilities and the face off requirements from his game.

He will be traded, he will become a winger on a line with some size, strength and defensive prowess to offset his and he will produce 50 points a year on a second line.

It just won't be and shouldn't be here.

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#114 oilerjed
January 08 2014, 01:04PM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:

I just want to make sure I'm getting the hang of Oiler fandom.

Pacioretty is taller than Yakupov, so this would automatically be a trade win, right?

hmm this is an odd inference. I understand your sarcasm but you'd still be better off saving the bytes you consumed with your post until you have something useful to say.

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#115 2004Z06
January 08 2014, 01:05PM
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Serious Gord wrote:

Larsen was a bad contract/poor player in return for a worse contract and somewhat better player.

Horcoff has played 41 games this season. Larsen has played 16.

How is Larsen's contract bad? Have you seen the numbers? Of course Horcoff is a better player than Larsen, he has how many NHL games under his belt compared to Larsen.

You are missing the point entirely. EVERYONE agreed dumping Horcoff's contract was impossible and if it could be done, the Oilers would have to retain salary.

The fact that Mac T didn't have to eat salary and received a prospect + pick on top is sheer genius!

The fact that the prospect and/or pick may not pan out is irrelevant.

He essentially got something for nothing.

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#116 pkam
January 08 2014, 01:06PM
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The Oilers Shot Clock wrote:

I doubt it's enough from Montreals perspective.

I guess nothing, not even Hall, will be enough from Montreals perspective.

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#117 Truth
January 08 2014, 01:08PM
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@TigerUnderGlass

Who do you take on your team, and why?

Michael Ryder: 33 yo, 6'1", 200 lbs - 69G previous 3 seasons

Max Pacioretty: 25 yo, 6'2", 217 lbs - 62G previous 3 seasons

David Backes: 29 yo, 6'3", 225 lbs - 61G previous 3 seasons

Michael Grabner: 26 yo, 6', 185 lbs - 70G previous 3 seasons.

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#118 pkam
January 08 2014, 01:16PM
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The Oilers Shot Clock wrote:

If Sam could get 2 legitimate and productive 3rd and 4th liners I'd make that trade. I'd give him to Washington for Chimera and Fehr.

I have no doubt you will. And I am glad you are not the Oilers GM or I'll lose my faith in Oilers much sooner.

I don't agree with all the moves MacT made, but not one he made that I disagree more than this.

Being said that, this is a much better suggestion than the previous one.

Honestly, I doubt the Caps will trade Chimera and Fehr for Gallagher, but I believe they will do it for Gagner, even without Klefbom.

So you still think Gagner + Klefbom is not quite enough for Gallagher?

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#119 A-Mc
January 08 2014, 01:18PM
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Truth wrote:

Who do you take on your team, and why?

Michael Ryder: 33 yo, 6'1", 200 lbs - 69G previous 3 seasons

Max Pacioretty: 25 yo, 6'2", 217 lbs - 62G previous 3 seasons

David Backes: 29 yo, 6'3", 225 lbs - 61G previous 3 seasons

Michael Grabner: 26 yo, 6', 185 lbs - 70G previous 3 seasons.

I'd be all over Backes!

Big. Is a Captain. Has some Jam, can score and he plays Center! He also has a wicked snipe, in-case you hadn't noticed.

Backes would be awesome for the Oilers!

***edit*** Just to be clear: we're talking who would we take 1-1 for Yakupov, right? I'd trade YakAttack for David Backes for sure but i dont think there is any hope in hell that St. Louis would even CONSIDER that trade. Yak doesnt bring enough to the table.. atleast not until he has a 30 goal season

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#120 jake
January 08 2014, 01:33PM
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He got 8 points with Hall and Eberle that night. So I would play him there in the run up to the olympics, and when the injuries start during the tournament, trade him the week after leading up to deadline.

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#121 Sisyphus
January 08 2014, 01:36PM
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The Oilers Shot Clock wrote:

If Sam could get 2 legitimate and productive 3rd and 4th liners I'd make that trade. I'd give him to Washington for Chimera and Fehr.

No chance in h3ll McPhee bites on that deal. The last thing WAS wants is a small, ineffective forward who is easily pushed around. Anyways, WAS needs a 1st line LW, and unless Hall is on the table coming back to WAS, I don't see them having any interest in what we have to offer. And since we all know Hall is going nowhere, its a non-starter

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#122 shaddup
January 08 2014, 01:57PM
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Josh Oiler wrote:

NAIL YAKUPOV + 2015 1st round pick for SHEA WEBER

Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny for Sid Crosby

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#123 Serious Gord
January 08 2014, 02:37PM
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2004Z06 wrote:

How is Larsen's contract bad? Have you seen the numbers? Of course Horcoff is a better player than Larsen, he has how many NHL games under his belt compared to Larsen.

You are missing the point entirely. EVERYONE agreed dumping Horcoff's contract was impossible and if it could be done, the Oilers would have to retain salary.

The fact that Mac T didn't have to eat salary and received a prospect + pick on top is sheer genius!

The fact that the prospect and/or pick may not pan out is irrelevant.

He essentially got something for nothing.

Dallas took on 7 mill of salary when they took Horcoff and got a serviceable third liner.

Edmonton took on 2.2 mill of salary for an AHLer.

So Dallas gets two years for 2.4/yr. not great. But not bad either.

MacT didn't win on the trade and he didn't lose. Horcoff is worth about that. And that he comes with a higher cap hit is a good thing as far are Dallas as concerned as it gives them some altitude above the floor. So in effect he ate thirty percent of the contract. And a seventh rounder should not be considered a prospect of any value. If I remember correctly that's the last round of the draft and Dallas likely will be somewhere in the middle so that player will be the 15th LAST person drafted - that's usually reserved for drafting friends and relatives kids... Maybe Katz has nephew who is draft age...

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#124 2004Z06
January 08 2014, 03:13PM
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Serious Gord wrote:

Dallas took on 7 mill of salary when they took Horcoff and got a serviceable third liner.

Edmonton took on 2.2 mill of salary for an AHLer.

So Dallas gets two years for 2.4/yr. not great. But not bad either.

MacT didn't win on the trade and he didn't lose. Horcoff is worth about that. And that he comes with a higher cap hit is a good thing as far are Dallas as concerned as it gives them some altitude above the floor. So in effect he ate thirty percent of the contract. And a seventh rounder should not be considered a prospect of any value. If I remember correctly that's the last round of the draft and Dallas likely will be somewhere in the middle so that player will be the 15th LAST person drafted - that's usually reserved for drafting friends and relatives kids... Maybe Katz has nephew who is draft age...

And conversely Edmonton shed the FULL cap hit of 5.5 x 3 years remaining on Horcoff's deal in a season when the cap went down. I think you are forgetting that important fact.

Mac T definitely won the trade from a financial perspective. I also said the pick and the prospect (which is all I consider Larsen at this point) was irrelevant.

The bottom line is he freed up 14.3 (subtracting Larsens 2.2)mil in cap space for a player that it was generally agreed would cost us money to get rid of.

How you see this is a negative is beyond me!

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#125 Old Retired Guy (A.K.A. Die-Nasty)
January 08 2014, 03:34PM
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Truth wrote:

Who do you take on your team, and why?

Michael Ryder: 33 yo, 6'1", 200 lbs - 69G previous 3 seasons

Max Pacioretty: 25 yo, 6'2", 217 lbs - 62G previous 3 seasons

David Backes: 29 yo, 6'3", 225 lbs - 61G previous 3 seasons

Michael Grabner: 26 yo, 6', 185 lbs - 70G previous 3 seasons.

Of this list I would take Backes. Perfect combination of size, toughness, skill and character for the Oilers needs. At 29 he's got at least 4-5 good years left in him.

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#126 pkam
January 08 2014, 03:39PM
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Serious Gord wrote:

Dallas took on 7 mill of salary when they took Horcoff and got a serviceable third liner.

Edmonton took on 2.2 mill of salary for an AHLer.

So Dallas gets two years for 2.4/yr. not great. But not bad either.

MacT didn't win on the trade and he didn't lose. Horcoff is worth about that. And that he comes with a higher cap hit is a good thing as far are Dallas as concerned as it gives them some altitude above the floor. So in effect he ate thirty percent of the contract. And a seventh rounder should not be considered a prospect of any value. If I remember correctly that's the last round of the draft and Dallas likely will be somewhere in the middle so that player will be the 15th LAST person drafted - that's usually reserved for drafting friends and relatives kids... Maybe Katz has nephew who is draft age...

Huh? Where do you get your number?

Larsen will be a RFA at the end of this season. So he has only one year left in his contract at 1.025M cap hit and 1.15M actual salary.

So 1.025M for a 3rd pair defenseman who has 6 pts in 16G is a bad contract? He has 7 pts in 7 games in OKC, leads all our defenseman in scoring in OKC. And best PPG among all our NHL defenseman.

Using your logic, Dallas is paying Horcoff almost 6M actual salary and 10M cap space over 2 years.

And using your logic again, we are getting paid 3M salary and 4.5M cap for a 3rd pair defenseman who leads all our defense in PPG. And that is a bad contract?

And MacT turned around and signed a better 3rd line center in Gordon who is younger, better in FO and PPG than Horcoff, with less salary and cap hit.

And your conclusion is fortunately MacT didn't lose this trade. I guess MacT should just take that 7th rounder and refuse to take Larsen.

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#127 Old Retired Guy (A.K.A. Die-Nasty)
January 08 2014, 03:40PM
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2004Z06 wrote:

And conversely Edmonton shed the FULL cap hit of 5.5 x 3 years remaining on Horcoff's deal in a season when the cap went down. I think you are forgetting that important fact.

Mac T definitely won the trade from a financial perspective. I also said the pick and the prospect (which is all I consider Larsen at this point) was irrelevant.

The bottom line is he freed up 14.3 (subtracting Larsens 2.2)mil in cap space for a player that it was generally agreed would cost us money to get rid of.

How you see this is a negative is beyond me!

It was a win- win which is the objective of most GMs.

And it was a classic example of how a successful trade is not about fleecing the other guy or about just talent for talent...it's usually situational....like this one.. Multiple pieces coming together to make it right for both teams. Situational also in this sense.....What's the value of James Reimer?.....well if your the Edmonton Oilers the value may be quite high.....if you're the Anaheim Ducks...not so much.

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#128 pkam
January 08 2014, 04:04PM
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2004Z06 wrote:

And conversely Edmonton shed the FULL cap hit of 5.5 x 3 years remaining on Horcoff's deal in a season when the cap went down. I think you are forgetting that important fact.

Mac T definitely won the trade from a financial perspective. I also said the pick and the prospect (which is all I consider Larsen at this point) was irrelevant.

The bottom line is he freed up 14.3 (subtracting Larsens 2.2)mil in cap space for a player that it was generally agreed would cost us money to get rid of.

How you see this is a negative is beyond me!

Horcoff has only 2 years, not 3 left in his contract.

And Larsen has only 1 year, not 2 left in his contract.

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#129 Jakethesnake
January 08 2014, 04:09PM
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WOW Things are getting crazy on here Edmonton must have some of the dumbest fans around

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#130 BIGDAWG
January 08 2014, 04:34PM
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Its awesome on how Tambo/Mac T missed the boat on getting a goalie.. Schneider, Bishop, Bernier, Elliot, any one would be nice...

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#131 pkam
January 08 2014, 04:42PM
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Serious Gord wrote:

Dallas took on 7 mill of salary when they took Horcoff and got a serviceable third liner.

Edmonton took on 2.2 mill of salary for an AHLer.

So Dallas gets two years for 2.4/yr. not great. But not bad either.

MacT didn't win on the trade and he didn't lose. Horcoff is worth about that. And that he comes with a higher cap hit is a good thing as far are Dallas as concerned as it gives them some altitude above the floor. So in effect he ate thirty percent of the contract. And a seventh rounder should not be considered a prospect of any value. If I remember correctly that's the last round of the draft and Dallas likely will be somewhere in the middle so that player will be the 15th LAST person drafted - that's usually reserved for drafting friends and relatives kids... Maybe Katz has nephew who is draft age...

Just want to make 2 more points in response to your comment.

Dallas really didn't have to get help to reach the salary floor when the cap was reduced to 64M after the new CBA.

Taking about 7th round picks, our latest 7th rounder drafted in 2013, Greg Chase at 18 years old is the leading scorer in Calgary Hitman and 12th in WHL, putting up 49 pts in 40 games. Not sure how he is related to Katz though.

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#132 Johnnydapunk
January 08 2014, 05:42PM
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BIGDAWG wrote:

Its awesome on how Tambo/Mac T missed the boat on getting a goalie.. Schneider, Bishop, Bernier, Elliot, any one would be nice...

I don't know if they missed the boat so much as it was a bit pricey to get on said boat.

It seems like he tried to get one of the goalies listed, but the "cost" was too high, and then he had hoped that Dubnyk could at least have a relatively decent season and then they can search for a UFA in the summer as there are quite a few available.

The Oil are giving up a comedy number of shots and as much as goaltending has been an issue (which it is for sure) I think that the shocking defence is also a massive issue that needs to be addressed as well.

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#133 nick
January 08 2014, 06:51PM
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The Oilers Shot Clock wrote:

If Sam could get 2 legitimate and productive 3rd and 4th liners I'd make that trade. I'd give him to Washington for Chimera and Fehr.

Nice try but Chimera hates MacTavish with a passion. Would never happen

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#134 Strange Tamer
January 08 2014, 08:00PM
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The Little and Gagne comparisons are pretty good. Small, soft forwards with decent offense, but not good enough to play 2C on a good team. Little is a bit more of a scorer though, has potted 30 before.

Thats the type of return we are likely to get for Gagne at this point if we want a 1 for 1 for an established player: small, over paid, and or defensively flawed.

Maybe we could get a perceived flawed player that turns out just needs a change of scenery or is a diamond in the rough, but I wouldn't trust the track record of our pro scouting to accomplish this.

So far MacT has done fairly well in trades. Dumping Horcoff seemed an impossible task without taking back a bad contract, but he accomplished it. Perron deal was best of the year so far. Smid deal looks like a stinker at present, he should of at least explained the reasoning behind it if he wanted cap relief for future moves, etc..., but so far MacT has done alright.

If Gagne is moved it would probably have to be for picks and prospects to maximze value, you are not going to get the top 6 F or top 4 D with size and grit we need for just him at his current value.

I'd like to propose a Gagne for Kreider deal. Slats loves dealing with his former team, also loves offensive skill. Kreider has had his growing pains with the Rangers, but has the speed and size the Oil could use. Change of scenery could benefit both. Rangers might even have to throw in a little something to sweeten the deal.

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#135 2004Z06
January 08 2014, 09:47PM
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pkam wrote:

Horcoff has only 2 years, not 3 left in his contract.

And Larsen has only 1 year, not 2 left in his contract.

Thanks for the correction on the numbers, but the premise of my point stands.

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#136 Death Metal Nightmare
January 09 2014, 05:06AM
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pretty hilarious how over the years the media/bloggers were saying, "Gagner is good. he's still only X years old. Just wait, he has the potential for 70 points. just wait. just wait." then he has a so-so HALF SEASON last year and everyone is fully on board with him being a main offensive weapon in the top 6 and supported the ridiculous contract. couple months later almost the entire fan base is against him and the media is acting like all their BS prophecies never existed.

"i remain smart, and can still see through everything. read my bullcrap. love, blogger"

no.

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#137 pkam
January 09 2014, 09:56AM
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BIGDAWG wrote:

Its awesome on how Tambo/Mac T missed the boat on getting a goalie.. Schneider, Bishop, Bernier, Elliot, any one would be nice...

I don't think Tambo/MacT missed the boat at all.

We have inquired about Schneider and Bernier but the price was just too high.

We all know the Canucks asked our 1st and 2nd rounder in 2013 and a high prospects, like Pitlick or Klefbom. I guess if MacT made that trade, you will be here blaming him for overpaying in a bonehead trade.

Leafs had to give a young goalie, a roster player and a 2nd round pick for Bernier. And LA asked for even more from the Oilers because we are in the same conference and division. Not sure if Bernier worth that much after watching his game against the Pens 2 night ago. That performance looked worse than any of Dubnyk's game.

We all knew Tambo made an offer for Bishop, I believe it is Ryan Jones and a draft pick, but Senators preferred a rookie and a pick from Tampa. Most fans said the Sens were crazy to choose the Tampa's offer but how is this Tambo or MacT's fault?

And Elliot? Really? He was traded to Avs by Sens in 2010-11, and Avs decided not to resign him and let him walked UFA. Did you see his performance in Sens and Avs in 2010-11? If you didn't, you can ask some Sens fans or go to NHL.com and watch the game highlight.

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#138 pkam
January 09 2014, 09:57AM
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2004Z06 wrote:

Thanks for the correction on the numbers, but the premise of my point stands.

Doesn't hurt to get the number right, does it?

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#139 2004Z06
January 09 2014, 10:51AM
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pkam wrote:

Doesn't hurt to get the number right, does it?

I believe I said thank you for the correction. Are you now rubbing it in?

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#140 armchair GMing
January 09 2014, 11:25AM
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I know we are all tired of Weber trade offers on ON, but I have a deal that I think makes sense for all involved. Here's my thought process:

Oilers desperately need a #1D (Weber), but no way Nashville gives him up without getting someone who can go some way to replacing Weber on D. Since the Oil do not have anyone like that, we go for a three-way trade and get Buffalo to send Erhoff (I know he has a NTC but if I was him I would flee Buffalo right now). To pry Erhoff from Buffalo we send over Petry (to go some way in replacing Erhoff) plus our first in this year's draft. Seems to me like an overpayment, so we also ask to get, say, a top 9F (M. Foligno?) from Buffalo as well. Then we send Eberle to Nashville to get Weber, and Nashville gets the first line sniper they badly need. Also noteworthy: some buzz was made at the start of the season when Jones was forced to his off-side to play with Weber, and Erhoff allows Jones to go back to his natural side.

To recap:

To Nashville: Eberle Ehroff

To Edmonton: Weber Top-9 Forward

To Buffalo: Petry Oiler's 2014 First Round Pick

A final note: the deal would be done after the season, so that Edmonton's pick would be most likely to retain its value.

Thoughts?

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#141 Cubro
January 09 2014, 11:37AM
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pkam wrote:

I don't think Tambo/MacT missed the boat at all.

We have inquired about Schneider and Bernier but the price was just too high.

We all know the Canucks asked our 1st and 2nd rounder in 2013 and a high prospects, like Pitlick or Klefbom. I guess if MacT made that trade, you will be here blaming him for overpaying in a bonehead trade.

Leafs had to give a young goalie, a roster player and a 2nd round pick for Bernier. And LA asked for even more from the Oilers because we are in the same conference and division. Not sure if Bernier worth that much after watching his game against the Pens 2 night ago. That performance looked worse than any of Dubnyk's game.

We all knew Tambo made an offer for Bishop, I believe it is Ryan Jones and a draft pick, but Senators preferred a rookie and a pick from Tampa. Most fans said the Sens were crazy to choose the Tampa's offer but how is this Tambo or MacT's fault?

And Elliot? Really? He was traded to Avs by Sens in 2010-11, and Avs decided not to resign him and let him walked UFA. Did you see his performance in Sens and Avs in 2010-11? If you didn't, you can ask some Sens fans or go to NHL.com and watch the game highlight.

So what you're saying is that management did "all they could" to acquire a #1 goalie. Obviously they didnt do good enough, maybe the asking prices were high but in this league you have to make these deals sometimes. Take off your rosy coloured glasses.

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#142 loweblows
January 09 2014, 11:41AM
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Jakethesnake wrote:

WOW Things are getting crazy on here Edmonton must have some of the dumbest fans around

Were not dumb. Insane yes.

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#143 DoubleDIon
January 09 2014, 11:53AM
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pkam wrote:

Gagner + Klefbom for Gallagher? Are you a Habs fan?

That would be an outright theft for you guys. Klefbom has potential, but he's struggling at the AHL level, while Gallagher is starring at the NHL level. He's a 200 foot player. Gagner doesn't have any trade value unless it's negative. No one wants a 4.8 million dollar liability. The piece you should be trading is Eberle, he'll never have more value than he does right now. Hang on to Yak and Gagner until they rebound, then deal their asses too. Hall and RNH are the building blocks. They shouldn't be traded for anything but a huge overpay.

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#144 DoubleDIon
January 09 2014, 11:56AM
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armchair GMing wrote:

I know we are all tired of Weber trade offers on ON, but I have a deal that I think makes sense for all involved. Here's my thought process:

Oilers desperately need a #1D (Weber), but no way Nashville gives him up without getting someone who can go some way to replacing Weber on D. Since the Oil do not have anyone like that, we go for a three-way trade and get Buffalo to send Erhoff (I know he has a NTC but if I was him I would flee Buffalo right now). To pry Erhoff from Buffalo we send over Petry (to go some way in replacing Erhoff) plus our first in this year's draft. Seems to me like an overpayment, so we also ask to get, say, a top 9F (M. Foligno?) from Buffalo as well. Then we send Eberle to Nashville to get Weber, and Nashville gets the first line sniper they badly need. Also noteworthy: some buzz was made at the start of the season when Jones was forced to his off-side to play with Weber, and Erhoff allows Jones to go back to his natural side.

To recap:

To Nashville: Eberle Ehroff

To Edmonton: Weber Top-9 Forward

To Buffalo: Petry Oiler's 2014 First Round Pick

A final note: the deal would be done after the season, so that Edmonton's pick would be most likely to retain its value.

Thoughts?

Well thought out. If Nashville wants to move the Weber contract that's a move that makes sense. They get a scorer which is a huge need for them and plug the Weber hole with a 2/3 type of guy. I think the top 9 forward could be the difference in value. Probably depends who it is and is would have to come from Buffalo.

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#145 2004Z06
January 09 2014, 12:11PM
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Cubro wrote:

So what you're saying is that management did "all they could" to acquire a #1 goalie. Obviously they didnt do good enough, maybe the asking prices were high but in this league you have to make these deals sometimes. Take off your rosy coloured glasses.

They also tried to get Raanta but he elected to go to Chicago. I don't believe anyone expected Dubnyk/Labarbera to be as bad as they were so it was likely the expectation that a .920 sv% would suffice to get through the season and then they would grab a goalie through free agency.

It was a gamble that didn't pay off, and Mac T then tried to rectify the situation by moving Labarbera and picking up Bryzgalov.

That's 10x the effort Tambellini would have expended.

The biggest issue in my eyes affecting all aspect of the Oilers success this year is the lack of legitimate NHL defensemen.

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#146 DoubleDIon
January 09 2014, 12:22PM
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@2004Z06

I think it was reasonable to assume that your goaltending would we averagish. What is inexcusable is not recognizing the surplus of one dimensional offensive guys and dealing Eberle for a top pairing defenseman. Everyone with half a brain could see that the Oilers had no top pairing defensemen. To go into this season without one meant this management still had either no clue or no playoff aspirations. Either way, it's inexcusable.

Gordon was a good start on a shutdown line, but they need another winger to play with him and Jones against other teams top groups.

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#147 pkam
January 09 2014, 12:32PM
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Cubro wrote:

So what you're saying is that management did "all they could" to acquire a #1 goalie. Obviously they didnt do good enough, maybe the asking prices were high but in this league you have to make these deals sometimes. Take off your rosy coloured glasses.

Why we always have to pay more than other teams to get a player? Why Devils can get Schneider with a 9th overall, and we can't get him for a 7th overall, and even with an additional 37th overall?

So paying a lot more to get a player means doing a good enough job?

And when we did overpay (Smid for a goalie prospect) and you guys are all over MacT.

Damn you do and Damn you don't, right?

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#148 pkam
January 09 2014, 12:48PM
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DoubleDIon wrote:

I think it was reasonable to assume that your goaltending would we averagish. What is inexcusable is not recognizing the surplus of one dimensional offensive guys and dealing Eberle for a top pairing defenseman. Everyone with half a brain could see that the Oilers had no top pairing defensemen. To go into this season without one meant this management still had either no clue or no playoff aspirations. Either way, it's inexcusable.

Gordon was a good start on a shutdown line, but they need another winger to play with him and Jones against other teams top groups.

The management didn't get a #1 defenseman didn't mean they didn't try. The problem here is we don't know if they did and who were they went after and what was the asking price. Most teams don't trade away their top pairing defenseman unless they are under performing or becoming UFA and are not willing to resign.

We all know MacT tried very hard to get Cal Clutterbuck and David Clarkson but both of them decided to go somewhere else. Actually, we heard that our offer to Clarkson was more than the Toronto offer. We also heard lots of rumors between the Oilers and Flyers. Who knows what the other side are asking for.

The Smid trade and Perron trade shows that MacT is willing to overpay a little to get what he wants. But if he constantly overpays a lot to UFAs and trades, he is not doing his job properly.

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#149 DoubleDIon
January 09 2014, 12:59PM
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pkam wrote:

The management didn't get a #1 defenseman didn't mean they didn't try. The problem here is we don't know if they did and who were they went after and what was the asking price. Most teams don't trade away their top pairing defenseman unless they are under performing or becoming UFA and are not willing to resign.

We all know MacT tried very hard to get Cal Clutterbuck and David Clarkson but both of them decided to go somewhere else. Actually, we heard that our offer to Clarkson was more than the Toronto offer. We also heard lots of rumors between the Oilers and Flyers. Who knows what the other side are asking for.

The Smid trade and Perron trade shows that MacT is willing to overpay a little to get what he wants. But if he constantly overpays a lot to UFAs and trades, he is not doing his job properly.

If you didn't get it done you didn't try hard enough. You can't tell me Eberle and your 1st isn't enough to get it done. It definitely is. You pay what you have to when you want to win. Eberle and a 1st gets you the top defenseman from any rebuilding team in the league. Trying and excuses are for losers. Good GM's fill the needs of their team. If MacT offered Clarkson more than the Leafs did he's a braindead idiot. If you think the Perron trade was an overpayment then you don't understand hockey at all. If you think the Smid trade did anything for you at all you don't understand hockey.

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#150 pkam
January 09 2014, 01:09PM
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armchair GMing wrote:

I know we are all tired of Weber trade offers on ON, but I have a deal that I think makes sense for all involved. Here's my thought process:

Oilers desperately need a #1D (Weber), but no way Nashville gives him up without getting someone who can go some way to replacing Weber on D. Since the Oil do not have anyone like that, we go for a three-way trade and get Buffalo to send Erhoff (I know he has a NTC but if I was him I would flee Buffalo right now). To pry Erhoff from Buffalo we send over Petry (to go some way in replacing Erhoff) plus our first in this year's draft. Seems to me like an overpayment, so we also ask to get, say, a top 9F (M. Foligno?) from Buffalo as well. Then we send Eberle to Nashville to get Weber, and Nashville gets the first line sniper they badly need. Also noteworthy: some buzz was made at the start of the season when Jones was forced to his off-side to play with Weber, and Erhoff allows Jones to go back to his natural side.

To recap:

To Nashville: Eberle Ehroff

To Edmonton: Weber Top-9 Forward

To Buffalo: Petry Oiler's 2014 First Round Pick

A final note: the deal would be done after the season, so that Edmonton's pick would be most likely to retain its value.

Thoughts?

If we can get Weber with Eberle, Petry and our 1st rounder, it is a no brainer and I don't think MacT will hesitate.

Jeff Petry and our 1st rounder (will be top 5, probably top 3) is more than sufficient for Ehrhoff. Buffalo will be crazy to decline that trade.

But I doubt Nashville would trade Weber for Ehrhoff and Eberle. There will be many teams willing to pay more for him.

If I am Polie, I will rather take Eberle, Petry and the Oilers 1st rounder than Ehrhoff and Eberle. Then try to get Ehrhoff with Petry and their 1st rounder (probably around 10th overall). But even with this scenario, the Nashville is still losing the trade.

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