Nugent-Hopkins Non-Starter

Jonathan Willis
February 26 2014 08:39AM

93-RNH-16

I don’t really believe in untouchable players. If the right deal comes along, any player is moveable.

But it has to be the right deal, and I don’t think there’s one out there involving Ryan Nugent-Hopkins.

The Speculation

Craig MacTavish2

On Monday, Oilers Now host Bob Stauffer asked guest Jim Matheson if he’d be open to a trade that would send one of Ryan Nugent-Hopkins or Taylor Hall, plus Jeff Petry, plus the Oilers’ 2014 first round draft pick, to Nashville in exchange for Shea Weber.

Our own Robin Brownlee wrote his take here, saying he’d make that deal but preferably with Hall rather than Nugent-Hopkins. Matheson provided his own write-up a day later, one with a little more ambiguity, but seemed to indicate that he’d be willing to consider that deal too.

In Craig MacTavish’s shoes, I wouldn’t make that deal with Nugent-Hopkins. For that matter, I wouldn’t make any deal that involved sending Nugent-Hopkins away for a top defenceman.

Robbing Peter to Pay Paul

93-RNH-10

Trades should address areas of weakness from areas of strength. Failing that, they should address hard-to-fix areas of weakness from easier-to-fix areas of weakness.

That isn’t what’s being discussed in the speculation above. The proposed deal involves blowing a massive hole in the Oilers’ centre ice depth chart in exchange for patching the massive hole in their defensive depth chart. That isn’t progress; that’s trading one problem for another.

Actually, it’s even worse than that. At least on defence, the organization has some internal candidates. Darnell Nurse is a blue chip prospect. Martin Marincin’s been exceptional as a rookie. Oscar Klefbom and Martin Gernat and Dillon Simpson are all waiting in the wings. These guys are all some distance away and none may ever be the equal of Weber, but there’s room for growth here.

At centre? Who can replace Ryan Nugent-Hopkins? Sam Gagner’s not the answer, and with all due respect to Mark Arcobello and Anton Lander, neither of them is ever likely to even approximate what Ryan Nugent-Hopkins will be at the peak of his career. There’s nobody else in the system, and if that wasn’t enough the proposed deal would send away Edmonton’s 2014 first round pick, which would be the team’s only realistic place to find a replacement for Nugent-Hopkins. Maybe fans here are resigned to drafting Connor McDavid next year, but it’s not going to get any easier for the Oilers to put distance between themselves and the bottom of the league if they stay there another season.

Nugent-Hopkins is scoring at a 60-point pace in a power-vs.-power role at the age of 20; he’s already a first line pivot and he’s probably three-to-five years away from hitting his peak level of performance. The player he’s going to become is extremely difficult to find; the No. 1 centre tree is as non-existent as the No. 1 defenceman tree.

Deals!

64-Yakupov-5

There is no Ryan Nugent-Hopkins trade that makes sense for the Oilers that doesn’t include a first line centre coming back the other way.

Jordan Eberle or Nail Yakupov can be moved in the right deal because the Oilers have both of them. In a perfect world, they’re both kept, but it isn’t insanity to try and patch holes elsewhere from a strong right wing depth chart. There’s less of a case to trade Hall, who is the best forward on the team today, but left wing is less critical than centre or defence and Edmonton has the option of moving Yakupov over and some depth there in the person of David Perron.

What about that 2014 first round pick? Sure, that’s a possibility too. The Oilers will get a good young player if they draft there, and a team can never have enough good young players, but in the right deal trading a draft pick like that isn’t going to hurt Edmonton’s already paper thin NHL depth chart.

Recently by Jonathan Willis

74b7cedc5d8bfbe88cf071309e98d2c3
Jonathan Willis is a freelance writer. He currently works for Oilers Nation, the Edmonton Journal and Bleacher Report. He's co-written three books and worked for myriad websites, including Grantland, ESPN, The Score, and Hockey Prospectus. He was previously the founder and managing editor of Copper & Blue.
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#51 Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things
February 26 2014, 10:55AM
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MKE wrote:

So why has no other GM done this if its such a good idea?

We are talking about Hall...who has a chance to be in the top 20 in scoring every year, and a potential top 3 pick!

That's much difference then Tlusty and a top 15 pick or Boedker and a top 20 pick!

Could you please go back and read over my comments? I'm not saying that this is a good trade for the Oilers to make. I am saying that this is fair value for Weber.

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#52 Taylor Gang
February 26 2014, 10:56AM
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Will wrote:

This all day. I would also like to add that the team with the two top point getters last year were one of the worst teams in the league. One man does not a good team make.

And to the other point about Wayne, I try and bring this up all the time and get shot down. The man's numbers are off the charts. However, I think a lot of that was the team he was on. That Oilers dynasty was insane. The mark of a dominant player is that he'll be dominant anywhere. And Gretz never lead another team to the cup. Messier did, twice.

I think that Messier was the single greatest captain that has ever played in this league.

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#53 MKE
February 26 2014, 10:57AM
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@Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things

In your opinion its fair. I disagree.

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#54 pkam
February 26 2014, 10:58AM
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Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things wrote:

My comment on downplaying his effectiveness was originally directed at these comments:

#10 MKE

I know Webber is a good dman, but it's not like he's won anything for Nashville. Even Webber and Suter together couldn't win anything for Nashville.

#8 Sliderule

Shea Weber is a hell of a good defenceman who is minus10 on a better team than oilers.

Nowhere in my comments have I said anything about that trade being one that would benefit the Oilers. He is probably worth a top line player, a 2nd-pairing D-man, and a 1st rounder, though.

I don't get the feeling that they are downplaying Weber when I read those 2 comments. The message I get is Weber couldn't single handedly help us to be a playoff or cup contender. Giving up Hall/RNH and our 1st rounder for Weber will probably make us the Preds.

Agree that Weber worth a top 6 forward, a 2nd pairing d-man and a 1st rounder. But not a top 6 forward who was a 1st overall who is trending to be an elite franchise player, and that 1st rounder is a top 3 overall pick. That is an overpayment.

I will do it if it is Eberle/Perron + Petry + a mid to late 1st rounder.

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#55 Taylor Gang
February 26 2014, 11:06AM
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pkam wrote:

I don't get the feeling that they are downplaying Weber when I read those 2 comments. The message I get is Weber couldn't single handedly help us to be a playoff or cup contender. Giving up Hall/RNH and our 1st rounder for Weber will probably make us the Preds.

Agree that Weber worth a top 6 forward, a 2nd pairing d-man and a 1st rounder. But not a top 6 forward who was a 1st overall who is trending to be an elite franchise player, and that 1st rounder is a top 3 overall pick. That is an overpayment.

I will do it if it is Eberle/Perron + Petry + a mid to late 1st rounder.

True. Picture another team trading away a budding superstar, a decent defenseman, and a top 3 pick in next years draft for Weber. You'd probably be yelling overpayment, which it would be.

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#56 Ricky
February 26 2014, 11:09AM
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Don't worry there will be no trades for the Oilers. Fans and Management overestimate the value of any player ..Teams won't give much for Hemsky or Gagner or Schultz so no trades will happen. Oilers are a bad team with overrated players. If you don't believe me look at their record for the last 8 years.

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#57 Dawn
February 26 2014, 11:12AM
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Who's brilliant idea was that to trade our #1 centre? Did they not see what happened at the beginning of the season when young Nuge was out and we had no NHL centres available to step in. Mad respect to Arcobello for surprising us all. But he's no Nuge.

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#58 Oilerfan
February 26 2014, 11:18AM
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Taylor Gang wrote:

I think that Messier was the single greatest captain that has ever played in this league.

Messier was the greatest human who ever put on skates.

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#59 TigerUnderGlass
February 26 2014, 11:21AM
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Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things wrote:

Hall and Nugent Hopkins haven't won anything with the Oilers, either. Does that make it ridiculous to suggest that they're worth a lot on the trade market?

Hell, Marcel Dionne never won a Stanley Cup. Guess it would have been stupid for teams to think about overpaying for him back in the day, too.

I don't think "overpaying" means what you think it means.

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#60 admiralmark
February 26 2014, 11:23AM
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I have said this in arguments before of course usually involving a trade to get Weber. It seems there is a extreme focus on Weber as the target to fix this teams D issues. Why i ask?? There are 29 other teams in this league of which there are likely a solid 15-20 1st pairing D that are phenomenal at their position. Now after spending the last 7 craptastic years acquiring assets i.e. Yak, Hall, Nuge.... whats the point in trading for a fix only to open up a gaping problem some where else.

Mmmmmmmaybe if we had an actual 2nd line C i could see it somehow working out to improve the team. But Nuge is THE only 1st and 2nd line center this team has. Gagner is a joke at the 2C position. So good luck with Weber on the back end and Gagner as your 1C with Boyd as your 2C. Sounds like the same game plan as the Nashville Predators if you ask me?

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#61 Freud
February 26 2014, 11:32AM
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All I know is this team better stop being so pathetic. They're worse than bad, and they better do somthing to figure it out. Enough is enough. Either turn this thing around or get new guys at the helm. No more waiting no more excuses

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#62 TigerUnderGlass
February 26 2014, 11:32AM
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Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things wrote:

Let's apply this formula to a few other teams - all of whom are better than the Oilers:

Winnipeg Little, Enstrom, and a 1st? All day every day.

Phoenix Boedker, Z. Michalek, and a 1st? Yes please

Carolina Tlusty, Hainsey, and a 1st? Without hesitation.

I could keep going, but I think you'll find that most teams would do this.

Wait - did you just say:

Tlusty-Hainsey-#8 = Hall-Petry-#2?

What madness is this?

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#63 TigerUnderGlass
February 26 2014, 11:34AM
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@Oilerfan

Messier was the greatest human.

Fixed.

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#64 pkam
February 26 2014, 11:34AM
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Gofucoffee wrote:

Kadri fills #2 center plays with more grit then Gags Gardner projects better then Petry long term IMHO A goalie with a contract... And filling a #2 winger is way easier then a center

Just compare Yak to Kessel. Yak was drafted 1st overall, Kessel 5th overall. Yak's stat was better than Kessel in their 1st 2 seasons.

If you think Yak is only a 2nd winger, what would it makes Kessel?

Would you trade Kessel for Kadri + Gardner + Remier + a 2nd rounder?

I wouldn't. So why would we trade Yak for this package? Not to mention we have to throw in Gagner + Petry and I don't care about Bryz.

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#65 Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things
February 26 2014, 11:37AM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:

I don't think "overpaying" means what you think it means.

The Kings acquired Dionne for Dan Maloney and Terry Harper, along with a 2nd and a pile of cash. At the time, I think you'll find that a lot of people thought this was an overpay. Dionne went on to play more than half of his HHOF career with the Kings.

Sometimes you have to overpay to acquire top-end talent, and sometimes they cover the bet.

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#66 Virtual_Xi
February 26 2014, 11:40AM
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Oilerfan wrote:

A fair trade would be Bryzgalov (Nashville needs to bolster their goalie depth) + Petry (a solid No. 2 NHL Dman) + Sam Gagner (he'll flourish once out of Edmonton) for Weber and Legwand. I think the Oilers could win 4 or 5 Cups with the new lineup.

why oh why can I only trash once! tell me CWD truck!!!!

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#67 MKE
February 26 2014, 11:43AM
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Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things wrote:

The Kings acquired Dionne for Dan Maloney and Terry Harper, along with a 2nd and a pile of cash. At the time, I think you'll find that a lot of people thought this was an overpay. Dionne went on to play more than half of his HHOF career with the Kings.

Sometimes you have to overpay to acquire top-end talent, and sometimes they cover the bet.

If by "cover the bet" you mean "didn't win any cups" then sure. But like Ricky Bobby once said....if you not first, you're last.

Anything short of a cup is failure

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#68 Virtual_Xi
February 26 2014, 11:43AM
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what everyone seems to think is this is a fair deal. anyone who wants weber better pony up. On that note, it's a sad pipe dream, because you're not getting him without giving up one of Hall or RNH. And those are the two guys I would never give up on.

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#69 Virtual_Xi
February 26 2014, 11:46AM
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"Actually, it’s even worse than that. At least on defence, the organization has some internal candidates. Darnell Nurse is a blue chip prospect. Martin Marincin’s been exceptional as a rookie. Oscar Klefbom and Martin Gernat and Dillon Simpson are all waiting in the wings. These guys are all some distance away and none may ever be the equal of Weber, but there’s room for growth here." -JW

JW, in '06, nashville had zidlicky, hamhuis, AND timmonen. I challenge any blue chip defenceman not to reach all start status with that blueline.

How are marincin, klefbom, gernat, and simpson going to get any better playing beside what we have now? There's a very good reason suter and weber are the players they are today.

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#70 Ricky
February 26 2014, 11:46AM
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Ricky wrote:

Don't worry there will be no trades for the Oilers. Fans and Management overestimate the value of any player ..Teams won't give much for Hemsky or Gagner or Schultz so no trades will happen. Oilers are a bad team with overrated players. If you don't believe me look at their record for the last 8 years.

Pretty funny I give facts and people still trash the comments.

Reality has jumped the shark with Oiler fans.

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#71 pkam
February 26 2014, 11:48AM
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Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things wrote:

The Kings acquired Dionne for Dan Maloney and Terry Harper, along with a 2nd and a pile of cash. At the time, I think you'll find that a lot of people thought this was an overpay. Dionne went on to play more than half of his HHOF career with the Kings.

Sometimes you have to overpay to acquire top-end talent, and sometimes they cover the bet.

So Hall and RNH is not top-end talent? Hall or RNH may be Dionne in this trade. Perhaps the Preds should overpay to get one of them, like Weber + their 1st rounder for Hall/RNH?

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#72 Old Retired Guy (A.K.A. Die-Nasty)
February 26 2014, 11:54AM
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Bracken Kearns put on waivers by the Sharks. Should the Oilers have any intrest in claiming him off waivers? How many open roster spots / contract spots do we have? One? Two?

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#73 Old Retired Guy (A.K.A. Die-Nasty)
February 26 2014, 11:55AM
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Also reading that Chris Phillips might be moved out of Ottawa, should the Oilers be interested?

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#74 Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things
February 26 2014, 12:01PM
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pkam wrote:

So Hall and RNH is not top-end talent? Hall or RNH may be Dionne in this trade. Perhaps the Preds should overpay to get one of them, like Weber + their 1st rounder for Hall/RNH?

Dionne was a known quantity by the time he was traded to LA. In 1975 he was 3rd overall in points behind Bobby Orr and Phil Esposito, and he was top-15 in points for the 3 years prior.

You could probably make the case that Hall is a known quantity as far as scoring is concerned, but I don't think all 30 GMs would agree that RNH is a lock to be a top 10 player in the league from 2015 through 2026.

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#75 pkam
February 26 2014, 12:03PM
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Oilerfan wrote:

A fair trade would be Bryzgalov (Nashville needs to bolster their goalie depth) + Petry (a solid No. 2 NHL Dman) + Sam Gagner (he'll flourish once out of Edmonton) for Weber and Legwand. I think the Oilers could win 4 or 5 Cups with the new lineup.

What can I say? Hope you are the Preds GM.

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#76 Time Travelling Sean
February 26 2014, 12:03PM
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I hate when people bring up trades that happened 30 years ago. Even without the cap it's a different league.

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#77 Spoils
February 26 2014, 12:06PM
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I really want to win with our current core crew. How much fun would it be to see Yak and Ebs lift the cup. After all this BS and losing, could anything be better?

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#78 Spoils
February 26 2014, 12:06PM
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maybe it works like this... apologies for including Ekblad in this, but if we are looking 3-5years for Nuge to peak you could make an argument for Nurse, Schultz, Klefbom, and Ekblad being a sufficient core with Nuge, Hall, Ebs, Yak at their peak - win multiple cups.

Man does that make for a tough next 2 years.

On the flip side, the Avs traded all 3 of their first overalls prior to winning.

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#79 Old Retired Guy (A.K.A. Die-Nasty)
February 26 2014, 12:15PM
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Spoils wrote:

I really want to win with our current core crew. How much fun would it be to see Yak and Ebs lift the cup. After all this BS and losing, could anything be better?

I want to win with or without our current core crew.

Sentimentalism will not win you cups.

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#80 pkam
February 26 2014, 12:17PM
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Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things wrote:

Dionne was a known quantity by the time he was traded to LA. In 1975 he was 3rd overall in points behind Bobby Orr and Phil Esposito, and he was top-15 in points for the 3 years prior.

You could probably make the case that Hall is a known quantity as far as scoring is concerned, but I don't think all 30 GMs would agree that RNH is a lock to be a top 10 player in the league from 2015 through 2026.

If they don't like RNH, they can have Hall.

My point is why is it always us overpay to acquire other team's top end talent? Can't we expect the other teams to overpay for our top end talents, or just a fair trade?

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#81 Old Retired Guy (A.K.A. Die-Nasty)
February 26 2014, 12:20PM
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@Spoils

Spoils has it right. The evidence strongly suggests that Oilers Management has already made the decision to build through the draft and are prepared to keep the young core, augment the roster on the periphery, and wait for the young D prospects to mature.

Generalized timeline for a cup contender is 4 to 5 years from now.

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#82 Randaman
February 26 2014, 12:20PM
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Consider this. Would Detroit have considered trading Datsuyk when he was not yet fully developed? NO WAY! That is who I see As a comparison to Nuge. Any talk of trading him is plain stupidity. Hall is a smaller version of Messier. Do you trade that? NO! Anyone else is fair game. For reasonable return. Yes, that includes Eberle & Yak

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#83 TigerUnderGlass
February 26 2014, 12:22PM
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Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things wrote:

The Kings acquired Dionne for Dan Maloney and Terry Harper, along with a 2nd and a pile of cash. At the time, I think you'll find that a lot of people thought this was an overpay. Dionne went on to play more than half of his HHOF career with the Kings.

Sometimes you have to overpay to acquire top-end talent, and sometimes they cover the bet.

1. "Overpay" still doesn't mean what you think it means. If you have overpaid then by definition you have paid too much. There are no means whereby an "overpay" can ever be the right move.

2. Re: Dionne: The Kings must have really dominated the league once they made that deal. If only there was some way to find out. Oh wait - In 74-75, the year before the trade, LA had 105 points. They next year with Dionne they had 85, and they never broke 100 again until 90-91.

The year before the trade Dionne had more points than all three guys he was traded for combined. In other words, it was probably only a slight overpay, and it still helped sink the team for a decade and a half.

This was a terrible example for you.

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#84 Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things
February 26 2014, 12:27PM
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pkam wrote:

If they don't like RNH, they can have Hall.

My point is why is it always us overpay to acquire other team's top end talent? Can't we expect the other teams to overpay for our top end talents, or just a fair trade?

It's been a long time since we've had any top-end current talents (as opposed to top end potential in prospects) that people were willing to trade, and those were screwed by the ineptitude of Oilers management. The last one I can think of (post-2008) would probably be Visnovsky or maybe Souray.

A competent GM probably could have gotten a premium for either of them at the deadline.

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#85 TigerUnderGlass
February 26 2014, 12:30PM
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Why is everyone assuming Edmonton has to give up one of their best players to get a top pairing defenseman?

When #1 defensemen move it is rarely for high end players, it is usually for packages of picks and prospects with 1 or 2 competent roster guys added.

So why suddenly do they need to give up one of their best players? It doesn't even make sense.

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#86 Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things
February 26 2014, 12:32PM
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TigerUnderGlass wrote:

1. "Overpay" still doesn't mean what you think it means. If you have overpaid then by definition you have paid too much. There are no means whereby an "overpay" can ever be the right move.

2. Re: Dionne: The Kings must have really dominated the league once they made that deal. If only there was some way to find out. Oh wait - In 74-75, the year before the trade, LA had 105 points. They next year with Dionne they had 85, and they never broke 100 again until 90-91.

The year before the trade Dionne had more points than all three guys he was traded for combined. In other words, it was probably only a slight overpay, and it still helped sink the team for a decade and a half.

This was a terrible example for you.

Overpay means exactly what I think it means, so long as you're not judging decisions with the benefit of hindsight. Can you cut the condescending crap for a minute?

If I pay $1500 for an ounce of gold today, I have most certainly overpaid. If - in 10 years - the price of that gold has increased at a rate that outpaced the other investments I could have reasonably made with that $1500, I look like a genius in hindsight, despite the fact that I intially overpaid.

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#87 Dan 1919
February 26 2014, 12:35PM
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@Spoils

If only it were that easy; external factors will crumble the team long before all the d-men in the minors develop if that's what management is counting on. These young guys say how happy they are now and that they still like being Oilers but they will start to ask for trades in the next few years if things don't change. You cannot draft until you win the stanley cup, it's just simply not that easy. They will need to make moves long before Darnell Nurse is a top dman in the NHL.

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#88 Old Retired Guy (A.K.A. Die-Nasty)
February 26 2014, 12:35PM
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@Randaman

Randaman. I agree with you on the Nuge Datsuyk thing. And I get why you're comparing Hall to Mess as they look similar in many ways. But, putting size aside, reality is that Messier was tough as nails right from the get go, by way of comparison at the same age, Hall is butter soft. You couldn't knock Messier down, Hall just naturally falls down. There's a reason why the Moose is a legend and a once in a generation type player.

This no knock against Hall. It's kinda like comparing RNH to Gretzky...there are similarities but it's really not a fair comparison.

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#89 Old Retired Guy (A.K.A. Die-Nasty)
February 26 2014, 12:41PM
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@TigerUnderGlass

You're right Tiger, It doesn't make sense. It's just some BS strawman that Stauffer through out as a question on his show...saying you would HAVE to give up Hall or RNH in any package for Weber....next Brownlee creates the same strawman in an Oilers Nation article.

Jim Matheson counters saying you don't need to have Hall or RNH in any such deal. For example Eberle, J Schultz and picks would get it done if you so wanted.

That's where all this conversation started.

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#90 Old Retired Guy (A.K.A. Die-Nasty)
February 26 2014, 12:44PM
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Dan 1919 wrote:

If only it were that easy; external factors will crumble the team long before all the d-men in the minors develop if that's what management is counting on. These young guys say how happy they are now and that they still like being Oilers but they will start to ask for trades in the next few years if things don't change. You cannot draft until you win the stanley cup, it's just simply not that easy. They will need to make moves long before Darnell Nurse is a top dman in the NHL.

Hey Dan....no one said that what they're doing is right.....but it is what they're doing.

That's not to say that they won't make a move for an Errhoff or Brian Campbell or whoever....but their core strategy appears to be develop through the draft and contend 3 to 4 years from now.

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#91 A-Mc
February 26 2014, 12:49PM
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A RW + Prospect not named Klef/Nurse + 2nd rnd pick, is the most i'd move for a defenseman. The only other option, depending on value, is using Gagner as part of it.

Someone earlier made the point that Nashville couldnt win with BOTH Suter and Weber... These guys are great players but they do NOT instantly make your team unstoppable. For my money i'd buy a defenseman in the 2/3 range and avoid the #1's if the cost is high.

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#92 oprah sucks
February 26 2014, 12:59PM
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oil need to trade to get the d thats needed. nows the time(deadline, draft or offseason). if not for weber then for someone whos a top pairing guy. i said it before and once again, with gags, yak, first rounder, prospects and one roster d (otherthan j schultz)should be a good enough bundle to land the dman that is needed! lets get it done. i will be dissappointed if september rolls around next season and we still dont have a top dman. if nothing pans out then worse case scenario draft ekblad. if first round pick doesnt include ekblad then trade that pick for more picks or for another piece of the puzzle that is needed for next season.

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#93 Bucknuck
February 26 2014, 01:05PM
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Untouchables (for me) are RNH, J. Schultz, and Hall. We've survived the growing pains with Schultz and I don't want him to go before we (the Oil) reap the rewards. Hall is the heart of the team, and RNH is the 1st line pivot the team has needed since Weight left town.

If you can't get a 1st pairing defender with trading chips like Eberle, Yakupov, Petry, the high draft pick, and all those defensive prospects in the system, you need to get a new job.

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#94 tabs
February 26 2014, 01:26PM
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Randaman wrote:

Consider this. Would Detroit have considered trading Datsuyk when he was not yet fully developed? NO WAY! That is who I see As a comparison to Nuge. Any talk of trading him is plain stupidity. Hall is a smaller version of Messier. Do you trade that? NO! Anyone else is fair game. For reasonable return. Yes, that includes Eberle & Yak

Until Hall plays with some nastiness and commands respect around the league, he should never have his name mentioned in the same sentence as Mark.

In terms of value of our three 1st overalls - Nuge will likely have the most accomplished career. With the right kind of management I expect Yak to become one of the best Russians to play in the NHL.

Hall is possibly the most immature of any 1st overall picks in a long time. Four years in the league and he's constantly heard in sounds bites using the F-word and slamming his stick against the glass/boards. Taylor next time you get frustrated hit someone but get this other crap out of your game.

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#95 Thumby
February 26 2014, 01:39PM
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Taylor Gang wrote:

I think that Messier was the single greatest captain that has ever played in this league.

Anyone who trashes this comment never saw him play in the playoffs...

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#96 tabs
February 26 2014, 01:54PM
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Messier was my favorite player of all time, best I ever saw. Mark won championship others won individual awards.

Presently we sit in 29th but I fear we'll somehow finish 26th. A couple meaningless wins and miss drafting the guy we really need.

Somehow the Oilers will re-sign Smyth, draft 5th and raise ticket prices making for another exciting NHL season ~

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#97 The Last Big Bear
February 26 2014, 01:56PM
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Shredder wrote:

I agree that Weber is the best dman in the league. I don't agree that we should be arguing over what it'll take to get him...it's killing me inside to read all these different thoughts. Personally, I think Nuge is the best player the Oilers have. His 2 way game is outstanding, and there's room for upside there. His offense makes everyone else better, he's already at a 60 point pace, and there's room to grow there. This kid is a stud. I wouldn't trade him for Weber straight up, even though I acknowledge Weber is in his prime and the best at his position, while Nuge is a few years from his prime and there's a risk he doesn't become the best at his position. If we get Weber, then what? Are we all done? Nope, still a long ways to go.

This is my favorite post in this thread.

You're willing to admit that there's a *risk* that RNH doesn't become the best centreman in the NHL?

I swear to god, my pee is going to turn blue after all the Kool-Aid in this thread.

Hey, here's a fun game: Go to other fan forums, and look for trade proposals where other teams are scheming to land RNH.

Take your time, I'll wait.

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#98 TigerUnderGlass
February 26 2014, 02:06PM
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Oil Kings 'n' Pretty Things wrote:

Overpay means exactly what I think it means, so long as you're not judging decisions with the benefit of hindsight. Can you cut the condescending crap for a minute?

If I pay $1500 for an ounce of gold today, I have most certainly overpaid. If - in 10 years - the price of that gold has increased at a rate that outpaced the other investments I could have reasonably made with that $1500, I look like a genius in hindsight, despite the fact that I intially overpaid.

Hilarious.

You just used an example of how hindsight could make you look like a genius in ten years to prove how decisions shouldn't be judged with the benefit of hindsight.

So your idea is to overpay and pray history proves you right? "Don't pay attention to what we know now because an incredible and flukey coincidence might save us all later!!"

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#99 TigerUnderGlass
February 26 2014, 02:11PM
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Ricky wrote:

Pretty funny I give facts and people still trash the comments.

Reality has jumped the shark with Oiler fans.

Given that what you wrote was an obvious opinion I'm going to go ahead and suggest that "fact" doesn't mean what you think it means.

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#100 ubermiguel
February 26 2014, 02:12PM
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pkam wrote:

Just compare Yak to Kessel. Yak was drafted 1st overall, Kessel 5th overall. Yak's stat was better than Kessel in their 1st 2 seasons.

If you think Yak is only a 2nd winger, what would it makes Kessel?

Would you trade Kessel for Kadri + Gardner + Remier + a 2nd rounder?

I wouldn't. So why would we trade Yak for this package? Not to mention we have to throw in Gagner + Petry and I don't care about Bryz.

Kessel's rookie season was slowed down at bit by the whole testicular cancer thing. Interesting comp though, by eye they are similar players. Kessel's built a bit more like a bulldog, but he's not a huge fan of defence either, and they both have that wicked shot.

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