1LINE C?

Lowetide
May 10 2014 10:07AM

rnh common

I've been operating under the assumption that the Edmonton Oilers plan to bring in a 2 line center. A "Gagner replacement" and someone who will play between RNH at the top and Boyd Gordon/Mark Arcobello down below. What if the Oilers plan this summer is to hire a 1line C, and have the Nuge kill the soft parade?

parkatti faceoffs

Parkatti wrote an excellent piece on the subject here, it's a terrific read.

The main point for our purposes today is the idea that bringing in a 1line center, a more veteran center, is a better idea than bringing in a secondary guy. Put another way, instead of talking about Nazem Kadri or Sean Couturier, we might be talking about Ryan O'Reilly or Paul Stastny.

WHAT WOULD IT COST?

In the case of O'Reilly and Stastny, money. Lots and lots of money. They are both free agents, and have a high degree of value. Over at Fansided's Mile High Sticking, Avs fans were asked to vote on which one to play, and the results are significant.

stastny or o'reilly


VOLLMAN SLEDGEHAMMER

vollman sledgehammer avs

This is the Vollman, and I'm using Corsi Rel (players relative to their teammates). Both players are getting tough competition and similar zone starts, and both have good to very good numbers. Offensively, they're sold, and both are quality in the faceoff circle, although O'Reilly took many fewer this season.

WHAT SAY YOU?

Assuming the Avs can sign only one, which player would you like to see in an Oiler uniform? Does it make sense to pay the max (this will be a grand contract, well past Hall's $6 million) and to hire a center who is more experienced? Thus allowing the Nuge to kill the softs?

kunis0

WHAT DOES IT ALL MEAN?

Make no mistake, we're talking about spending the defensive money on a center. However, with Parkatti's information, and understanding the Nuge needs some help, is this a better plan?

It might be.



C2a6955161684b5e3189319acfa5ebe4
Lowetide has been one of the Oilogosphere's shining lights for over a century. You can check him out here at OilersNation and at lowetide.ca. He is also the host of Lowdown with Lowetide weekday mornings 10-noon on Team 1260.
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#1 Oilers Coffey
May 10 2014, 10:20AM
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This is what Ive said before, The Nuge was basically given the 1st line C, on a sparkling silver platter the day he was drafted. This is ultimately managements issue giving this to an 18 YO. No doubt Nuge is going to be fantastic but expecting a 18-20 YO to step up against Jumbo Joe, Kopitar, and even Kesler was asanine. There needs to be internal competition, someone to push every position on the ice to be their best and play with the consistency us Oilers fans are dieing to see.

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#2 Bishai in the Benches
May 10 2014, 10:28AM
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RexHolez wrote:

They can do whatever they want. Just stop sucking so bad. It's embarrassing to be an oiler fan. I just hope this is Lowe's last swing of the bat.

Thanks for your constructive comments. I'm sure a new President of Hockey Operations would go into the dressing room, tell the team to stop sucking so bad, and we'd be a cup contender for sure. I'm so glad you've got this all figured out.

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#3 Oilerguy
May 10 2014, 10:33AM
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I'm not one to blame the coach but the handling of Nuge this year drove me crazy. If you think back to his rookie year, he played his own style. He used his brain and got into the open areas. He knew he wasn't a giant and as a result, played a game that used his strengths. His brain, stick, and skill.

Under Eakins, he tried to turn him into a different player. How many times did you see Nuge battling along the boards? Not his game. I know he needed to get stronger, but that will come over time.

Let him play his game.

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#4 mike
May 10 2014, 10:12AM
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Nuge needs to rebound.

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#5 baggedmilk
May 10 2014, 10:12AM
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I like the idea of chasing a Statsny but I dread how much it would cost to get him here.

MacT dodged a bullet by having Clarkson sign in Toronto last summer, but has he learned from that? We shall see.

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#6 RexHolez
May 10 2014, 10:14AM
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They can do whatever they want. Just stop sucking so bad. It's embarrassing to be an oiler fan. I just hope this is Lowe's last swing of the bat.

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#7 Bishai in the Benches
May 10 2014, 11:10AM
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@RexHolez

Agreed, he/Tambo have made stupid decisions and brought in bad players. But players play the game, not management. The reason the oilers suck is because, largely, the oilers players suck. Changing out the POHO like you suggest does absolutely nothing. This team belongs to MacT now. I also agree that Lowe shouldn't have a job anymore, but the days of him screwing the oilers with stupid decisions are long gone. Firing him would do NOTHING to change the product on the ice. People like you who do nothing but spam FIRE LOWE everywhere don't actually understand how hockey works.

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#8 Mike
May 10 2014, 11:29AM
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I'm tired of the excuses with the Oilers . MacT has only been a GM for 1 year. Eakins only has had 1 year. Calgary Flames had a better record than Edmonton. That is all you need to know.

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#9 Vince
May 10 2014, 12:03PM
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Mike wrote:

I'm tired of the excuses with the Oilers . MacT has only been a GM for 1 year. Eakins only has had 1 year. Calgary Flames had a better record than Edmonton. That is all you need to know.

Calgary does not have the talent Edmonton has , not even close, but they work hard. Eakins could not even this group to work hard. Put a guy like Barry Trotz in as coach at least you will see some effort.

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#10 Walter Sobchak
May 10 2014, 10:59AM
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John Chambers wrote:

Still think we see Eric Staal in C&B silks this fall.

E.Staal has two years left at 8.2 million with a NTC?

Explain to me how and why both the Oiler's and E.Staal would want to come here?

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#11 1979
May 10 2014, 10:29AM
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I like this plan and think it is certainly more effective then Cobourne for D. I think there is a greater possibility the Oilers D improves next year with little change then the top 6 improving without a major addition. Also, long term we may already have the pieces of a great defense whereas it is clear we need another centre to complete our top 6.

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#12 OilersDynasty
May 10 2014, 10:34AM
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Out of those 2, O'Reilly. He's younger, he's more defensively sound, he's disciplined as outlined by his almost perfect PIM'S this year, and his age is in range with our guys.

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#13 oilers
May 10 2014, 12:18PM
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Bishai in the Benches wrote:

Agreed, he/Tambo have made stupid decisions and brought in bad players. But players play the game, not management. The reason the oilers suck is because, largely, the oilers players suck. Changing out the POHO like you suggest does absolutely nothing. This team belongs to MacT now. I also agree that Lowe shouldn't have a job anymore, but the days of him screwing the oilers with stupid decisions are long gone. Firing him would do NOTHING to change the product on the ice. People like you who do nothing but spam FIRE LOWE everywhere don't actually understand how hockey works.

Wrong. Lowe is the problem because he is the leader who picks his management team and thus the record. Worst team past 8 years.

This has nothing to do with hockey. It is called organization leadership which looking at Lowe's record he has none.

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#14 RexHolez
May 10 2014, 11:58AM
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Bishai in the Benches wrote:

Agreed, he/Tambo have made stupid decisions and brought in bad players. But players play the game, not management. The reason the oilers suck is because, largely, the oilers players suck. Changing out the POHO like you suggest does absolutely nothing. This team belongs to MacT now. I also agree that Lowe shouldn't have a job anymore, but the days of him screwing the oilers with stupid decisions are long gone. Firing him would do NOTHING to change the product on the ice. People like you who do nothing but spam FIRE LOWE everywhere don't actually understand how hockey works.

If firing Lowe will have no impact then whats the point of keeping him? He should be fired simply to show that being the 2nd worst team in all pro sports isn't acceptable.

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#15 oilers
May 10 2014, 12:09PM
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Oh dream on.. no top 1st line Centre in Coming to edmonton. The agents would never do that to their a-list assets. Those are their money players, their most important properties.

Would u send your top asset to Lowe and mac t with their record?

No agent would. Dream on edmonton dream on....

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#16 kdunbar
May 10 2014, 10:29AM
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Great Idea, but the questions are...

will they be willing to come here?

Do you pass on a trade at the draft for a 2C in the hopes of getting a 1C and letting RNH be the 2C?

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#17 RossCreekNation
May 10 2014, 10:52AM
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O'Reilly is an RFA, so along with $, he's gonna cost 3OV and/or a significant package of players/prospects/picks.

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#18 Tim
May 10 2014, 10:33AM
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Advanced stats should only be used to confirm what coach/GM already knows.

Way too many intangibles with Hockey .

That said either centre would be a welcome addition.

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#19 seanjohn667
May 10 2014, 08:01PM
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RexHolez wrote:

Blow me. He's the reason were in this position, period. But I guess you're an oiler fan so you have no problems with being a loser. Lets just keep everything the same.

i respect you opinion, but i completely disagree. It is the POHO that attracts (or doesn't) top talent. It is the POHO that sets the direction of the team, ie. thinking the NHL is becoming a speedy, skilled league again, and therefore, drafting small wingers over and over. It is the POHO that has to stand up to the owner when he insists on picking the players he likes, but the scouts don't. It is the POHO that runs a professional organization that hires the best, and fires the incompetent, or hires friends and doesn't have the stones to let them go. It is the POHO that gives the impression of professionalism that can attract FAs. There is sooooo many examples and plenty of evidence that KLowe absolute must go, it is miles beyond argument. Seriously, not trying to be a jerk, but defense of KLowe is ridiculous. The man is cleary bad for the organization and is hurting it in many ways. As long as he is at the helm, they will never be taken seriously by FAs and agents.

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#20 Rama Lama
May 10 2014, 10:27AM
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If we can get the Nuge to start eating donuts along with Marinincin we should be off to the races for next year.

As far as the fate of a second line center goes sign Stastny he plays a good solid game and let's not trade away our future. Trading Gagner for some draft choices would be my preference.

Leave the new draft choices in junior ..........if we are going to do this re-build right we need to stop panicking for next year..........we need to wander in the desert for at least another two years.

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#21 2004Z06
May 10 2014, 10:43AM
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Oilerguy wrote:

I'm not one to blame the coach but the handling of Nuge this year drove me crazy. If you think back to his rookie year, he played his own style. He used his brain and got into the open areas. He knew he wasn't a giant and as a result, played a game that used his strengths. His brain, stick, and skill.

Under Eakins, he tried to turn him into a different player. How many times did you see Nuge battling along the boards? Not his game. I know he needed to get stronger, but that will come over time.

Let him play his game.

Every player needs to battle along the boards. How do you think you gain/maintain puck possession or break up a cycle.

I hate to break it to you, but winning puck battles is a significant part of playing hockey.

Currently the Oilers have no players that can consistently win a puck battle. Hence the problem of the Oilers always being pushed off the puck and playing in their own end.

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#22 Jeffff
May 10 2014, 06:57PM
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I wonder how the fans will react to not making the playoffs for the next 2yrs. Can't wait for the excuses.

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#23 PoBoy
May 10 2014, 07:15PM
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Jeffff wrote:

I wonder how the fans will react to not making the playoffs for the next 2yrs. Can't wait for the excuses.

You mean the next 5

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#24 oilers
May 10 2014, 10:41PM
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seanjohn667 wrote:

i respect you opinion, but i completely disagree. It is the POHO that attracts (or doesn't) top talent. It is the POHO that sets the direction of the team, ie. thinking the NHL is becoming a speedy, skilled league again, and therefore, drafting small wingers over and over. It is the POHO that has to stand up to the owner when he insists on picking the players he likes, but the scouts don't. It is the POHO that runs a professional organization that hires the best, and fires the incompetent, or hires friends and doesn't have the stones to let them go. It is the POHO that gives the impression of professionalism that can attract FAs. There is sooooo many examples and plenty of evidence that KLowe absolute must go, it is miles beyond argument. Seriously, not trying to be a jerk, but defense of KLowe is ridiculous. The man is cleary bad for the organization and is hurting it in many ways. As long as he is at the helm, they will never be taken seriously by FAs and agents.

Perfectly said.

All you Lowe lovers are doomed to follow a loser till the end of time.

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#25 RexHolez
May 10 2014, 11:00AM
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Bishai in the Benches wrote:

Thanks for your constructive comments. I'm sure a new President of Hockey Operations would go into the dressing room, tell the team to stop sucking so bad, and we'd be a cup contender for sure. I'm so glad you've got this all figured out.

Blow me. He's the reason were in this position, period. But I guess you're an oiler fan so you have no problems with being a loser. Lets just keep everything the same.

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#26 Oiler63
May 10 2014, 07:23PM
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If we stick to the $6M ceiling then forget about a top D from out of the organization.

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#27 big slick
May 10 2014, 11:28AM
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Zangetsu wrote:

I like the idea, except for the part of exceeding Hall's contract. I thought he was supposed to be the highest paid on the team ala Lindstrom in Detroit. It could potentially create a rift in the room, and it would definitely inflate the contracts of the new prospects coming of contract age.

If the Oilers win more and become a playoff team. I highly doubt Hall will care if someone gets paid more money. I do agree it could inflate contracts but free agency always does. Given the Oilers upcoming (and cheaper D) I think this type of move makes sense. I hope the Oilers are active in free agency for centers, there seems to be quality at that position. On defense, none of the free agents seem to jump out at me, so I think that issue is better addressed through trade or draft.

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#28 Sketchy
May 10 2014, 12:36PM
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Bishai in the Benches wrote:

Agreed, he/Tambo have made stupid decisions and brought in bad players. But players play the game, not management. The reason the oilers suck is because, largely, the oilers players suck. Changing out the POHO like you suggest does absolutely nothing. This team belongs to MacT now. I also agree that Lowe shouldn't have a job anymore, but the days of him screwing the oilers with stupid decisions are long gone. Firing him would do NOTHING to change the product on the ice. People like you who do nothing but spam FIRE LOWE everywhere don't actually understand how hockey works.

Let me try and follow you here. The management brought in bad players but its not their fault because the bad players they brought in are bad? I don't understand what you're trying to say

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#29 Dan
May 11 2014, 02:29AM
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Nuge needs to grow a pair for one thing. He has played pussy hockey from the start. I haven't heard him say even once post game anything but the usual blah blah blah about how the team is improving and getting better. He is one big bag of excuses. Bad pick. He clearly gasn't got what it takes. Bad pick.

Eberle and Schultz are the same style of player. All offence no defence and no apparent likelihood of change. Nut transplants all round please.

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#30 Ari Gold
May 11 2014, 11:31AM
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billions wrote:

we need a first line centre a first line winger a first line bruiser a first pair dman, a president of hockey operations who is not an ass hole like kevin lowe and someone who appreciates the fans.

Oh and someone who is not french canadian, cuz god damn those frenchies are idiots.

We could probably use a black guy or two-- usually pays dividends

Oh and better music at the games, get DJ Azaad

How is a post like this acceptable?

You, sir, are a clown. Stop worrying about what languages players speak and the colour of their skin. If you're just classlessly trying to get a rise out of everyone, you've succeeded. If you actually believe this, you've got some growing up to do, regardless of your current age.

Moving on....

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#31 admiralmark
May 10 2014, 01:55PM
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Sketchy wrote:

Let me try and follow you here. The management brought in bad players but its not their fault because the bad players they brought in are bad? I don't understand what you're trying to say

I think what he's trying to say is we get it. 1)Lowe has screwed a lot of things up. 2)Lowe shouldn't have a job at this point. 3)We are mad about it.

BUT: At this point its gonna make zero difference to fire him. AND it's getting real real REAL boring to read for the 2,673,999th time someone respond with. It doesn't matter as long as Lowe is in place this team will never win. Or fire Lowe that will send a message that incompetence won't be tolerated anymore. etc etc etc.

Personally now when I read a comment along the lines of Fire Lowe being the answer to all that is wrong with the Oilers? It looks more like Blah blah blah blah blah...

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#32 Danoilerfanincalgary
May 10 2014, 05:20PM
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If you can sign a free agent and lose no assets why concern ourselves with overpaying a player if it does not affect the cap? We would be lucky if any of those players were interested in coming to Edmonton to begin with. I liked it better when we didn't know salaries and everything was based solely on their play. I am more concerned with the Oilers asset management as our habit of trading or losing players for nothing e.g.Greene,Stoll,Ciogliano,Glenncross,Brodziak etc. let's see… 3rd and 4th line centres who win face-offs, a big heavy tough defensive defenseman and a solid top nine winger with an edge just what this team needs.

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#33 OilClog
May 10 2014, 07:59PM
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Spezza

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#34 Mr common sense
May 10 2014, 12:50PM
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I was never sold on Noogie as a 1st line C, even in red deer his most dominant side of the game was on the pp.

Imagine this: Instead of Hall (who I love but will break down like iginla), noogie, yak, the oil had taken Seguin, Landeskog, Murray. Our 1C, 1D and bruising winger problem of today would not be one.

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#35 Quicksilver ballet
May 10 2014, 04:19PM
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@RossCreekNation

Also, almost zero chance Sean Couturier is moved in PHI.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ding ding ding ding, winnah, lets select another young top center, maybe even a little better than Sean. I'd think the Flyers are more likely to move Couturier than, say, the Boston Bruins are in moving a Tyler Seguin. That guy is a lock to be a Bruin for a long long time. Don't you think Ross?

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#36 Jeffff
May 10 2014, 07:17PM
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PoBoy wrote:

You mean the next 5

Yes, your right.

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#37 Lofty
May 11 2014, 02:07PM
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Marcincin 47 minutes played in the worlds in two games. Leading the team. Its the little things in May.

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#38 Zangetsu
May 10 2014, 10:21AM
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I like the idea, except for the part of exceeding Hall's contract. I thought he was supposed to be the highest paid on the team ala Lindstrom in Detroit. It could potentially create a rift in the room, and it would definitely inflate the contracts of the new prospects coming of contract age.

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#39 Zarny
May 10 2014, 02:06PM
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Targeting a 1C is a good plan. O'Reilly is the better option because he's 23 and just entering his prime; Stastny is 28 and only has 2-3 more years left in his prime.

It would not be spending the D money on a C. It would be a ticket out of town for Jordan Eberle; possibly in a package for a 1D.

And that's probably the best move the Oilers could make. 30 G 70 PT RW are nothing to sneeze at, but they aren't irreplaceable.

That or the salary cap goes up a lot.

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#40 oilers
May 10 2014, 03:14PM
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nunyour wrote:

Wrong,this is Katz team.If you or I owned the team,changes would have been made already,no?

Oh yes, I agree. Would fire Lowe and all the current management. Complete clean house and change from a losing culture and arogance to a positive constructive leadership model.

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#41 oilers
May 10 2014, 03:17PM
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admiralmark wrote:

I think what he's trying to say is we get it. 1)Lowe has screwed a lot of things up. 2)Lowe shouldn't have a job at this point. 3)We are mad about it.

BUT: At this point its gonna make zero difference to fire him. AND it's getting real real REAL boring to read for the 2,673,999th time someone respond with. It doesn't matter as long as Lowe is in place this team will never win. Or fire Lowe that will send a message that incompetence won't be tolerated anymore. etc etc etc.

Personally now when I read a comment along the lines of Fire Lowe being the answer to all that is wrong with the Oilers? It looks more like Blah blah blah blah blah...

Yup I agree with blah blah blah.

This is why we will be the recycle bin for NHL garbage from agents as a last ditch effort.

So, do what Vancouver did. Stop going and speak up.

It would also help if our media were not so in bred and spineless.

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#42 Jimmer
May 10 2014, 04:24PM
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KLowe replaces Bob Nicholson. Problem solved. Now back to the actual topic...Nuge is will be fine. A centre looks bad...really bad...if you don't have a good defence. Fix the D first please...then assess what we need at centre.

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#43 Thatguy
May 11 2014, 03:31AM
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@Dan

I do agree that there are a few too many of the same players in Nuge, Ebs, Gags and Shultz. A couple also should probably be moved to create a more dynamic roster which can give and take "Heavy Hockey". Because this whole passing it into the net with these overly adored young skinny good at trick shots in practice type players isn't getting anything done 'round these parts. Then again most of oil nation would shart a collective brick if we had to ship out a good player for a good player. Like any team would somehow want some magic beans and spare parts for their significant investments.

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#44 Sketchy
May 10 2014, 02:09PM
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admiralmark wrote:

I think what he's trying to say is we get it. 1)Lowe has screwed a lot of things up. 2)Lowe shouldn't have a job at this point. 3)We are mad about it.

BUT: At this point its gonna make zero difference to fire him. AND it's getting real real REAL boring to read for the 2,673,999th time someone respond with. It doesn't matter as long as Lowe is in place this team will never win. Or fire Lowe that will send a message that incompetence won't be tolerated anymore. etc etc etc.

Personally now when I read a comment along the lines of Fire Lowe being the answer to all that is wrong with the Oilers? It looks more like Blah blah blah blah blah...

Ok I gotcha. I'll stop talking about it and just accept Lowe for what he is. I'll just fall in line, support the team and get excited over our newest high draft pick added to the collection.

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#45 Bishai in the Benches
May 10 2014, 11:39PM
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@oilers

Holy crap.... I am FAR from a Lowe lover. I'm just saying that the results from this season are solely based upon player performance for this season, and these are MacT's players. HE needs to make the changes necessary to win. IMO Lowe doesn't have much power or say anymore. He messed up, but firing him now is simply an accountability move (still needs to happen) and won't change the team's fortunes next year unless new players are brought in.

Get good players, keep good players.

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#46 jonny94
May 10 2014, 12:47PM
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As much as I'd love to have Stastny on the Oilers I don't think we should give a contract any bigger then Hall.

Call me crazy but I'd like the Oilers to follow a pay structure that no one makes more then Taylor Hall. It's the same idea Detroit did with Lidstrom.

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#47 GCW
May 10 2014, 05:15PM
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I would love to see the Oilers grab Stastny. But I would guess he will cost the Oilers $7.5M per season.

That would give the Oilers a top six costing approximately $33.2m. It's doable but it means value contracts are needed outside the top six, which then means Ference and Hendricks are a problem.

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#48 madjam
May 11 2014, 08:10AM
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The team does not require it to have all Lucic type players . Boring hockey if it was . We need more size and physically to surround our young base . Your not going to get much physicality from our youthful seeing as they are not that type of player to begin with . They can still be more combative in battles , however , and that's what Eakins appears to be instilling in them . Progress , although slower than anticipated or hoped for in this regard ,is still pretty limited but is moving forward somewhat .

It' about getting some more players on each top line to open up our type of game and handle the physicality aspect for each line . We presently do not have that ,even though Perron I classify as combative . You still need superior skill to compliment size and physicality - two way street .

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#49 John Chambers
May 10 2014, 10:39AM
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Still think we see Eric Staal in C&B silks this fall.

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#50 nunyour
May 10 2014, 01:37PM
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oilers wrote:

Wrong. Lowe is the problem because he is the leader who picks his management team and thus the record. Worst team past 8 years.

This has nothing to do with hockey. It is called organization leadership which looking at Lowe's record he has none.

Wrong,this is Katz team.If you or I owned the team,changes would have been made already,no?

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